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Classical Club - January 2006 - Messiaen!
Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 2:16 pm
by Usivius
Ok, I was going to pick a piece from my favourite composer (W.A. Mozart) but someone made a comment about picking a 20th century composer, so I have picked up the gauntlet.
Olivier Messiaen - "Turangalila Symphony"
now before you roll your eyes and say, "Oh my god, that 'monster' is over 75 minutes long!"
...I am going to narrow the study of this one to its 'Introduction'. It is a full and busy piece of music that I think deserves its own examination as a separate entity. The whole symphony is facinating and controversial, and we could go in to detail forever on its various movements (10 in all, I think), but let's just stick to the first one, the "Introduction".
How does this sound?... So if everyone is OK with this, I will start the discussion on Thursday January 5, 2006 (gads, another year slipped by...)
till then!...
Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 11:43 pm
by duchess of malfi
I'm certainly game.
I might need a few days to track it down, though.
Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 3:52 am
by matrixman
Wow! Great pick, Usivius! I don't know much about Messiaen, and I've never heard the "Turangalila" symphony. I tend to skip past his name when browsing through the classical section, so this time his music will have my full attention. Looking forward to the new year's discussion!
Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 6:18 am
by duchess of malfi
Rather than braving the store at this crazy time of year I think I shall order this version:
www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/ ... 0?v=glance
It is very highly rated, and since it is on Naxos, it is very nicely priced.
Editorial Reviews
Amazon.com
If you don't already own a copy of Messiaen's epic, weird, and beautiful Turangalîla Symphony, here's your chance. And if you already own a copy, pick up this CD, anyway--you'll love it. Conductor Antoni Wit and the Polish National Radio Symphony deliver an awe-inspiring reading of the complex work, showcasing all the drama, tonal colors, and spiky rhythms the Turangalîla demands. Messiaen's 10-movement work is a grab bag of musical themes from throughout the composer's career; you'll find elements of birdsong, Eastern mysticism, a gorgeous "love theme," and serialism in this epic composition. With this much going on, it's no wonder that few ensembles (however famous) get it right. But Wit and company do get it right, letting the masterpiece's multiple themes (statue, love, flower, chord) all unfold dramatically, with great playing all around. Naxos's sonics are remarkable as well, capturing the magnitude of the 100-piece orchestra and providing a rich balance during the tricky passages for ondes martenot (a sort of glorified theremin). As a bonus on this budget priced, two-CD set, we get L'ascension, an earlier work from Messiaen but one that's just as interesting. Here, intense rhythms are replaced by lush symphonic passages, but the playing is just as splendid. Highly recommended. --Jason Verlinde
Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 8:24 am
by matrixman
I'm going to look for that version too, duchess. It was also given an enthusiastic review on that Inkblot website you linked to in the Mahler Fifth thread.
Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 11:15 pm
by Fist and Faith
Wow, I haven't listened to Messiaen in a loooong time! And I never knew him that well, so I'd love to hear about this!
His Quartet for the End of Time, composed while in a Nazi prison camp, is a pretty damned great piece!
Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2006 5:37 pm
by Usivius
OK, here we go.
"Turangalila", as I understand it, stranslates from two Sanskrit words meaning "time" and "divine game", of creation. The peice is suppose to be a love song. The opening "Introduction" certainly sets an ominous tone. I can't help but hear it and feel great tension and disorder, like some impending doom or catastrophe.
Admittedly I have done little reading on this peice of music (or any others) to any great detail. I listen to a peice and allow it to move me emotionally, ignorant of any background. This is no exception. 'Introduction' is a frightening opening to this symphony. I am always affected by it. At about 3:30 of the peice, the orchestra burts forth in an array of dream-like sounds filled with longing, fear, and a nightmarish threat. And the ending of it leads us in to what is to come: more uncertainty...
This is the 'beauty' of 20th Century compositions. Dissoneance, constantly changing time signatures, unease ... can fill a composition and still be 'beautiful' (sometimes
)
OK, that's my initial reaction to this piece. Before I go in to more detail, I am curious to hear how others were/are affected by this piece...
Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2006 2:25 am
by duchess of malfi
I have listened to the piece in its entirety twice now, as well as reading the album notes.
I really enjoy the menacing quality of that one theme, heard both in the introduction and throughout the work. The notes call it the "statue" theme.
I hear that and immediately think it would be perfect in a movie soundtrack -- and I mean that in a good way. The villain/monster/horrible threat is coming!
Run away! Run away!
It's a lot of fun.
Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2006 4:16 am
by Damelon
I've been meaning to track this down. I've listened to
Quartor Pour Le Fin de Temps and found it inspiring.
On the negative side though, Pierre Boulez, Messiaen's pupil, didn't have a good remarks for Turangalia, likening it to brothel music.
www.musicaltimes.co.uk/archive/obits/19 ... siaen.html
Boulez is rather opinionated though.
I mean to get to the bottom of it this week.
Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2006 4:31 am
by matrixman
Well, I haven't been able to find a recording of the Turangalila locally yet (and I don't shop on the internet), so I can't join the discussion. This is what happens when the store with the best classical music selection in my city closes.
Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2006 1:45 pm
by Usivius
Hey, MM, aren't you just over in Manitoba?... let me know if you want me to send you a copy of this work... 'pm' me your address is you want, I can send one over...
Must share...
Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 7:40 am
by matrixman
Yes, sir, I'm in Winnipeg. Thanks for the offer, Usivius!
Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 12:50 am
by duchess of malfi
Well, when all is said and done, I did enjoy it enough to pick up a copy of
Music for the End of Time. I've been fighting off a bad cold since before Christmas, and been very busy lately, though, so have not had time to listen to that piece yet. But I am looking forward to hearing it.
Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 4:25 am
by Fist and Faith
I listened to this piece twice today. Never heard it before, so I couldn't comment at all. I still haven't heard it enough to have a good enough understanding of it. It has many great moments and exciting changes. Sometimes reminescent of this, sometimes of that. I particularly like the piano.
I need to listen more, and see if I can hear an overall form.
Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 4:36 am
by duchess of malfi
I know that there were three repeating themes. One was the statue theme (that ponderous, threatening music I liked so much).
One was the flower theme. One was the love theme.
Two listenings were not enough to pick up on all of the intracacies of their interweavings in the various movements.
Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 1:53 pm
by Usivius
my thanks to Lucimay for making this 'sticky'. But what I was actually hoping (and I guess we should have input from 'the gang'), is to make this posting a part of the "Classical of the Month" thread. so that each month there can be a new classics listened to and discussed under one thread instead of making a new one each month.
<shrug> but it doesn't matter to me... whatever is good.
Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 2:40 pm
by Damelon
I purchased it, but haven't had the chance to listen to it all the way through. In the next day or so, I should be able to listen to it all the way through.
Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 4:45 pm
by matrixman
Does this thread really need to be stickied? Having this stuck at the top of the forum serves only to re-inforce the view that classical music fans are elitists.
Personally, I'd prefer that each dissection be in its own thread to allow for easier referencing of each composition. But I can live with one big undifferentiated thread too. (shrugs)
Haven't yet listened to the excerpt of the Turangalila that Usivius sent me. But thanks, good sir. Will post my thoughts later.
Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 5:30 pm
by Damelon
I can see a temporary sticky, for a week or so to invite discussion, but after that everyone who's going to comment on the thread will have done so and there is no reason to keep that status.
I think there should be a different thread for each piece. To me it keeps the discussion more relevant.
Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 7:17 pm
by dANdeLION
If you want it stickied, let me know. I don't see any harm in doing it, either short or long term. As for classical music being for snobs; I think that's not quite true. I like listening to classical music, and I have some classical cds, but I don't really take things beyond that.