Geography and other ramblings...

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Starkin
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Geography and other ramblings...

Post by Starkin »

Hi all!

Just had something I wanted to... just... talk about, I guess! Cuz I really don't have any deep questions here. I suppose you could say its just something I've always wanted to discuss but never had anybody to discuss it with! In general, I've always been fascinated with the geography of fantasy worlds and the world-building process: the various landforms, the extremes of climate, the histories of the different races and strange beings that inhabit those realms.

There are many detailed fantasy worlds out there: Middle-earth (probably the MOST detailed), Pern, Midkemia, Westeros, and the various 'gaming' worlds of Dragonlance and the Forgotten Realms (though I'm not comparing those last two works in any way to SDR's!). There is something awesome (to me) about an author who can create a world with nearly the same depth and physical elements of our own. Esp concerning maps (one of my favorite pastimes).

SRD gives us landform descriptions and their histories from the Land in such depth, beauty and grandeur- who can forget Covenant's first view of Landsdrop (or the story of how it possibly came to be)? Or of Mount Thunder as it kneels on its edge? Or of sparkling Andelain as Atiaran and Covenant head towards the Celebration? Or Giant-wrought Revelstone? Or Garroting Deep, Melenkurion Skyweir, the Soulsease, and Kevin's Watch? Or the Sarangrave as Linden looks down on it with her health sense? One of the most powerful descriptions to me of 'landform personification' (is that an actual term or did I just make that up...?) is the Rawedge Rim surrounding Elemesnedene in 'The One Tree'-

"As Linden's eyes adjusted to the gloom, she saw the gray walls more clearly. The granite looked wounded and unforgiving, as if it had been unnaturally reft to provide this channel and were now waiting in rigid impatience for any upheaval which would allow it to close back over the water, sealing its dire heart from further intrusion. Studing them with her percipience, she knew that these mountains were very angry. Affronted. Only the ancient slowness of their life prevented their umbrage from taking palpable form."

I don't know many authors who can bring the very earth alive like SRD can. The Land is definitely a character in it's own right. How horrifying it is then to see it suffer so much under the Sunbane.


Covenant's Blood-Speed in 'The Wounded Land' is another example of how SRD brings depth to the physical Land: As Covenant runs, the lands west of Andelain fly by and we learn what some of their various 'half-forgotten' names were: Boulder Fash, Emmacrimma's Maw, Greshas Slant, Graywightswath, Andelainscion, Kurash Festillin... oh, how I wish the rest of the Land could be explored like this in the text! I can just imagine the fantastic names SRD could give us. I have an insatiable need to know things like that. :) But what possible use could they be if he did? It's cool, but in SRD's mind, probably unneeded. As a map maker, though, it would be fantastic to put on paper.

One other thing I love to speculate on in the case of fantasy and maps is the unexplored lands along the edges. We know the Land is roughly the size of the US (according to the Atlas) and is protected (or shielded) from the outside world by the Sunbirth Sea on the east, the lifeless Gray Desert to the south, and the Northron Climbs and Snowy Plains to the north. What lies to the west? The Westron Mountains are there, but what lies beyond them? What is the 'Outer Earth'? Logically the Haruchai might know these lands and whatever peoples inhabit them, but SRD usually doesn't mention anything that doesn't have some signifigance or impact on the story. Even his casual references to Sandgorgons, the Elohim, the Bhrathair and Dancers of the Sea in the First Chronicles were later explored and explained later on (he even mentions that he 'mined' the FC for the Second). Other authors, on the other hand, go out of their way to add 'literary vistas', esp, again, Tolkien. Sometimes things like that clutter up a story (ahem, Jordan); other times it adds great depth. It's what I like to refer to as 'falling into a story'.

The world outside of the Land also intrigues me. No map is given to us of what the rest of the Earth might look like or even the general shape of the coastlines. Bhrathairealm, to me, looks like it could be the geographical equivalent of Morocco (the coastline is similar), and the land of the Elohim is Scandanavia-like with its mountains and fjords. The Sunbirth Sea is like the north Atlantic in that respect, so the Isle of the One Tree could be somewhere like the Azores or Canary Islands (or Bermuda). The Giants Homeland- where could it be? On some inland sea like the Mediterranean? Or an out-of-the-way island like Australia? And what keeps the Giants from getting back Home? The Elohim exacting a price for the gift of tongues? The various Soulbiters moving around? Does Foul have a hand in it?


Gee, I've been on here for an hour and have went on and on and I don't even know if I've made a point or not (or any sense)! It's just a subject that interests me. Any feedback, speculation, or *anything* interesting to say would be great if anybody has anything.

Thanks for 'listening'! :D

Starkin

P.S. (I am working on a map of the Land at the moment. Purely for my own satisfaction- every place name in the text that I can find will be on it! Including Banyan Woodhelven (south of Soaring). When I'm done (God knows when) I'll try to post it to see what everybody thinks. Hey, I'm relatively good at it. 8)
"Ah, my daughter, do not fear. You will not fail, however he may assail you. There is also love in the world. Be true."
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Post by UrLord »

Sounds great! One of the interesting things about the Last Chronicles will be what new information we'll get about the history and geography of the Land's Earth, so you might end up scrapping your entire map of the world when/if SRD reveals more concrete details about the geography.
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matrixman
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Post by matrixman »

Great post, Starkin! Thanks for sharing your thoughts! It's always nice to read such enthusiastic words about the Chronicles. You've touched on a lot of things I've thought about as well, over the years.
who can forget...Garroting Deep, Melenkurion Skyweir, the Soulsease, and Kevin's Watch? Or the Sarangrave as Linden looks down on it with her health sense?
Yes, Linden's first view of the Sarangrave at dawn is very cinematic, as the sun reveals the lovely and fatal glory of the swamp to her senses. A beautiful and chilling scene.

In another thread I mentioned how I loved it whenever SRD took us into the dark and mysterious places of the Earth, like Garroting Deep and Melenkurion Skyweir, and Mount Thunder. The sense of vast powers inhabiting the darkness is awesome. It's no surprise that for me, the most thrilling and haunting parts of the books are when our heroes journey through these places.

As for the mountains around the home of the Elohim...there's a thread where we discussed that very subject. My thought was that it was the Elohim who made the mountains angry because they used their power to "gouge" out an area for their home. I wonder if in the Last Chronicles we will indeed see the mountains' umbrage "taking palpable form." 8O

Concerning world geography and more Elohim discussion, have you by chance read any posts by Mystikan? He has made some very thought-provoking observations on these subjects. For your convenience, here are the links to those threads:

Geology of the Land

The One Tree, Chapter 6: The Questsimoon

Regarding the Giants' inability to find Home, I think we had a good discussion about that, if I can just find the darn thread. I don't think Foul had any hand in throwing the Giants off course or whatever. They're small potatoes to the Despiser. He just let his Ravers deal with them.

Anyway, good luck on your map! 8)
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Starkin
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Post by Starkin »

:Hail:
I am truly, truly humbled here. Wow. Thank you so much Matrixman for giving me those links. How did I miss those before?

Mystikan has hit the nail on the head concerning the geography, climate patterns and land placement, something I NEVER could've articulated so well. And the Elohim observations. AND the whole italics thing (something I've always wondered about myself). Again: Wow. He really knows his stuff.

So glad to see people as interested in such things like I am. And SO glad that I found Kevin's Watch in the first place! You guys are awesome!!
:D :D :D

Starkin.
"Ah, my daughter, do not fear. You will not fail, however he may assail you. There is also love in the world. Be true."
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Insanity Falls
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Post by Insanity Falls »

'Fraid I haven't got anything helpful to add -

except to say THANKS Starkin for a very enjoyable read - it really was like being back in that awesome World again ...

... it's a beautiful place!

And it's got me excitedly anticipating reading the Chronicles again (as I will before the last book comes out! )

I'll be very excited to see your maps, (especially as I've never seen "The Atlas".)

Happy Mapping!
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Post by stuartfanning »

For those interested, you can get a copy of The Atlas of the Land pretty cheap now.

www.abebooks.co.uk/servlet/SearchResult ... d&sortby=2
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