Kevin's Dirt - or Foul's Breath?? (possible causes+++)

Book 1 of the Last Chronicles of Thomas Covenant

Moderator: dlbpharmd

User avatar
Insanity Falls
Elohim
Posts: 114
Joined: Wed Nov 17, 2004 1:52 am
Location: Milky Way UK

Kevin's Dirt - or Foul's Breath?? (possible causes+++)

Post by Insanity Falls »

If Kevin's Dirt was caused by Foul, wouldn't it be named after him?
And he is so pleased thing are going awry, and not by his hand!

Then is Thomas Covenant the source of Kevin's Dirt?
In the Second Chronicles, Covenenant had no healthsense, coz of having leprosy for over a decade, and the inability, then, of the Land to heal him.
I was wondering, now he's gone all Wild Magic, 'n' all, whether this "blindness" hasn't now magically imposed itself on the Land, so that (nearly) everyone is blinded.
I'd kind of like it to be Thomas Covenant's fault!!

However that doesn't really tie in with a smog covering just the Land.
Given that it does just cover the Land, it makes me thing that either it is

a) an emission of Mount Thunder, with it's banes 'n' all, as has been suggested.

or

b) a relapse/re-assertion of the corruption of the Earthpower that caused the Sunbane, made possible because of the loss of the staff. It does kind of makes sense that the Sunbane would have begun by blinding the people first to what was happening. Then again, why hasn't it progressed? Because Foul's not pushing for it?

Or perhaps it is the ghost of the Sunbane :twisted: , thanks to the Laws of Life and Death being broken :!:


My bet now is on (a) Mount Thunder. Simplest is probably best! As someone suggested, Mount Thunder is probable disturbed by earth-shaking events in the north.

HOWEVER, this thing surely would have to have crept up on people, else they'd said "Hey! What's going on?". And volcanic activity tends to be rather sudden!
Didn't Linden's Healing enable people to recover their healthsense?
Did the Haruchai had gone all totalitarian before this thing started. But why would they do that anyway?

What the hell is up with the Haruchai anyways? That's the big mystery I think! Bet TC will have something to say about that! The Harachai plumetted in my estimation when they abandoned the Lords in a time of war. What was that about?
Have the Haruchai been corrupted via their mental link?

I bet Sunder and Hollian's ghosts are feeling pretty stupid now for not working to establish new Lords with new Lords's staffs (made from Gildens growing in Andelain?). Why wouldn't the Dead guide them to do that?

I am tickled by all this mystery that SRD has created!

What's it all about?! ( I do hope it all adds up! )
Last edited by Insanity Falls on Mon Nov 29, 2004 12:29 pm, edited 3 times in total.
"The first quality that is needed is audacity"
~ Winston Churchill
User avatar
Insanity Falls
Elohim
Posts: 114
Joined: Wed Nov 17, 2004 1:52 am
Location: Milky Way UK

Post by Insanity Falls »

It doesn't add up yet, so I guess it's really all down to the new players...
"The first quality that is needed is audacity"
~ Winston Churchill
User avatar
Creator
The Gap Into Spam
Posts: 4865
Joined: Wed Jun 16, 2004 3:51 am
Location: Oak Ridge, NC

Post by Creator »

If the Haruchai's passion can lead to the Bloodguard oath - why couldn't their current passion to "block" the use of Earthpower lead to the "dirt" which "blocks" health sense? [Health sense would be an important aspect of how the folk of the Land could "tune in" to Earthpower.]
He/She who dies with the most toys wins! Wait a minute ... I can't die!!!
esmerlover
Stonedownor
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Nov 27, 2004 8:53 pm

Post by esmerlover »

I think the name of the affliction itself holds the answer. Kevin's Dirt.

What did Kevin do? Ritual of Desecration.
When did the Demondim vanish? Ritual of Desecration.
Why'd they vanish? Esmer took them.
Who brought the Demondim to Linden after she reclaimed the staff of law? Esmer.
When did Kevin's Dirt start? When Linden took the staff from the past to the present.

So, here's what I'm thinking. What if the Ritual of Desecration caused Kevin's Dirt? Then when Esmer brought the Demondim from that time to assail Linden, he also brought along part or all of the Dirt. The Dirt was then able to sustain itself and spread because Linden took the staff to the present and the staff was not there to withstand it.

It fits, no?
"Defend yourself, heartless one, lest I destroy you."
User avatar
High Lord Tolkien
Excommunicated Member of THOOLAH
Posts: 7393
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 2:40 am
Location: Cape Cod, Mass
Been thanked: 3 times
Contact:

Post by High Lord Tolkien »

esmerlover wrote:I think the name of the affliction itself holds the answer. Kevin's Dirt.

What did Kevin do? Ritual of Desecration.
When did the Demondim vanish? Ritual of Desecration.
Why'd they vanish? Esmer took them.
Who brought the Demondim to Linden after she reclaimed the staff of law? Esmer.
When did Kevin's Dirt start? When Linden took the staff from the past to the present.

So, here's what I'm thinking. What if the Ritual of Desecration caused Kevin's Dirt? Then when Esmer brought the Demondim from that time to assail Linden, he also brought along part or all of the Dirt. The Dirt was then able to sustain itself and spread because Linden took the staff to the present and the staff was not there to withstand it.

It fits, no?
NICE!
:D
I love it.
https://thoolah.blogspot.com/

[Defeated by a gizmo from Batman's utility belt]
Joker: I swear by all that's funny never to be taken in by that unconstitutional device again!


Image Image Image Image
User avatar
Insanity Falls
Elohim
Posts: 114
Joined: Wed Nov 17, 2004 1:52 am
Location: Milky Way UK

Post by Insanity Falls »

Me too! :Hail:
"The first quality that is needed is audacity"
~ Winston Churchill
Wormwood
Servant of the Land
Posts: 18
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:11 pm

Post by Wormwood »

Nice theory. Only one thing doesn't fit for me. The loss of healthsense benefits the Haruchai's drive to eradicate access to earthpower too much to be a coincidence. I think that somehow the Haruchai are responsible for Kevin's Dirt. It's utility to the flat faced little NAZI's is just to fortuitous to be coincidence.
esmerlover
Stonedownor
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Nov 27, 2004 8:53 pm

Post by esmerlover »

Good point, Wormwood. However, from my interpretation, I'd take the Master's desire to stop the use of earthpower as misguided and influenced by Foul himself "I have only whispered a few words of council here and there and awaited for events to unfold to my will".

If Foul didn't cause Kevin's Dirt to come about himself, he probably recognized its presence before anyone else and derived his plan from its existance and provided false council to the Haruchai from there.

"They serve me, albeit unwittingly"
"Defend yourself, heartless one, lest I destroy you."
Wormwood
Servant of the Land
Posts: 18
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:11 pm

Post by Wormwood »

I think Foul whispered the words, and somehow the Haruchai managed to make it (the Dirt) happen. They are, in their own way, earthpowerful as well. Didn't the 2nd Chronicles describe their blood as somehow more concentrated in earthpower than normal blood when feeding the banefire? They may profess to wish to limit access to earthpower, but in the past they have exercised tremendous feats using earthpower (the Vow, which is as powerfull than death).

I'd say that Foul put the idea that earthpower is bad in their heads, and then they went from there. Based on their nature and past, I don't doubt that they could have found a way to implement Kevin's Dirt.
esmerlover
Stonedownor
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Nov 27, 2004 8:53 pm

Post by esmerlover »

There are no previous instances where the Haruchai have used any lore or Earthpower to affect anything in non-physical means.

Even the Vow was just an amplification of their own inherit strength and puissance.

No. The Haruchai have always relied on their personal skill and strength in combat to achieve their ends. If they affected the Land in some other way it would betray their honor.

If they themselves had used their Earthpower to create the Dirt it would contradict their own believe that any exhertion of Earthpower inevitibly leads to evil and loss.

Why would they then create the Dirt to prevent the use of Earthpower (which leads to evil) if the creation of the Dirt itself would lead to evil?
"Defend yourself, heartless one, lest I destroy you."
tallan
Ramen
Posts: 86
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 6:08 pm

Post by tallan »

Erh. I've always interpreted it as they didn't do it knowingly... It just sorta happened, as the Land's reaction to the loss of knowledge of Earthpower and such... mighty things. :shifty:
Image
User avatar
I'm Murrin
Are you?
Posts: 15840
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2003 1:09 pm
Location: North East, UK
Contact:

Post by I'm Murrin »

A manifestation of the Land's ignorance, eh?
An expression of earthpower caused by there being no more expressions of earthpower, which makes further expressions of earthpower even less likely to occur.

Hmm.

I like it! :D
esmerlover
Stonedownor
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Nov 27, 2004 8:53 pm

Post by esmerlover »

Right.

But why is it named Kevin's Dirt? Surely Kevin had something to do with it. I doubt SrD would just randomly pick a name and attach it if the name didn't hold any siginficance.
"Defend yourself, heartless one, lest I destroy you."
User avatar
drew
The Gap Into Spam
Posts: 7877
Joined: Sun Sep 12, 2004 4:20 pm
Location: Canada
Been thanked: 1 time
Contact:

Post by drew »

The haruchai named it, because it reminded them of the ROD.
I thought you were a ripe grape
a cabernet sauvignon
a bottle in the cellar
the kind you keep for a really long time
User avatar
dANdeLION
Lord
Posts: 23836
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 3:22 am
Location: In the jungle, the mighty jungle
Contact:

Post by dANdeLION »

Kevin's Dirt...I think the Elohim put it there, and I think it's called Kevin's Dirt because you could see it clearly from Kevin's Watch, or because it blinds people to the truth of things like Kevin was blinded to the truth about Foul.
Dandelion don't tell no lies
Dandelion will make you wise
Tell me if she laughs or cries
Blow away dandelion


I'm afraid there's no denying
I'm just a dandelion
a fate I don't deserve.


High priest of THOOOTP

:hobbes: *

* This post carries Jay's seal of approval
Wormwood
Servant of the Land
Posts: 18
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:11 pm

Post by Wormwood »

The Haruchai may not know they put it there at all. Perhaps they invoked it much as they did the Vow, simply through the force of making a promise to stop the use of earthpower was enough to make Kevin's Dirt occur. The Vow happened pretty much the same way.

It's not like SRD doesn't try to teach his characters about the law of unintended consequences (The Ranyhyn promise, The Oath of Peace, etc...)
Findail The Appointed
Servant of the Land
Posts: 22
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2002 11:44 pm

Post by Findail The Appointed »

When did Kevin's Dirt start? When Linden took the staff from the past to the present.
Actually it was generations before that if I'm not mistaken. Linden observed from atop Kevin's Watch when she first re-entered the land.

But why is it named Kevin's Dirt? Surely Kevin had something to do with it.
Well, there ware the Clave's titles of Na-Mhoram which didn't actually have much to do with the original Mhoram. If anything, I think I'd go with the theory of it being visible only from KW...


[/quote]
"Let those who sail the Sea bow down;
Let those who walk bow low:
For there is neither peace nor dream
Where the Appointed go.
esmerlover
Stonedownor
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Nov 27, 2004 8:53 pm

Post by esmerlover »

Sorry if I didn't make it clear enough.

Kevin's dirt started when Linden removed the staff from the past. Not when she arrived back in the present.
"Defend yourself, heartless one, lest I destroy you."
Adept Havelock
Servant of the Land
Posts: 23
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2004 10:07 pm
Location: Kansas City, MO

Post by Adept Havelock »

If I'm not mistaken, there is a reference in Runes that states the Haruchai named it Kevin's Dirt, as it seemed like a "foretaste of desecration".

I'm just starting my reread of Runes (having finished 2nd chronicles last night) and will post the complete quote once I reach that point in the story.

On a side note, for an interesting experiece I recommend reading One Tree and White Gold Wielder when you are quite ill, as I've spent the last few days. It had an interesting effect on my perception of the story, and the emotions generated by it.
Oh wad some power the giftie gie us
To see oursel's as others see us!
It wad frae monie a blunder free us,
And foolish notion.

Robert Burns (1759-1796)
Adept Havelock
Servant of the Land
Posts: 23
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2004 10:07 pm
Location: Kansas City, MO

Kevin's Dirt:

Post by Adept Havelock »

It's on page 135 of Runes of the Earth, while Linden is receiving Stave's "Earthpower" lecture.

His answer had the finality of a knell. "We name it so because we deem it to be a foretaste of desecration. It's pall covers the Land in preperation".
Oh wad some power the giftie gie us
To see oursel's as others see us!
It wad frae monie a blunder free us,
And foolish notion.

Robert Burns (1759-1796)
Post Reply

Return to “The Runes of the Earth”