How do singularity grenades work?

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miru
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Post by miru »

Thank you for your compliments, Loremaster, I do try. As to my "clever" reference to Chandraskhar's limit, I meeeeAAGH! 8O =stares at his sudden increase in gold-count in shock= Woah...thanks! =immediately deposits all 10,000 in his bank with glee= As I was saying, I merely happen to have read Larry Niven's 'Neutron Star', and remembered the similarities between TH's point and the terminolgy given there to explain black holes, so I looked it up and voila. Like I said, I don't actually understand much of the techno-babble beyond theoretics, but I am intimately interested in it nonetheless. (sp?) Your inability to understand how Hashi makes singularities last is something I'm afraid I can't help with either, save to point out the fact how far in the future the gap series is set, and that we could not possibly comprehend the scientific methods used in such practices in the same way that cave-men could barely comprehend fire, and would never understand the complexities of electric heaters, let alone atomic bombs, whereas we now know intimately about both. In essence, perhaps attempts to fully understand the science behind advanced technology is impossible until our scientists make the concept into fact-based theory . Of course, when they make theory into practice, we'll have to move onto even more advanced questions, and our science fiction writers will have to be very, very imaginitive in order to keep us intrigued. Then again, perhaps in the future, ideas for new technology will still be as easy to come upon as they are now...though personally I think we'll all be well dead by the time singularity grenades become as commonly used as nukes. :wink:
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Post by Loredoctor »

Good points, miru. At least sci-fi has that one fall-back option to 'explaining' technology: it's the future - they have the advanced understanding and technology - it works!
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Post by miru »

Of course, it is that option and the choice that most authors take with it that irritates me the most about science fiction. You see I have the very bad habit of feeling the need to scientifically justify any oddities or advancements I write about, usually in a form remarkably similar to Donaldson's ancillary documentation. I absolutely fell in love with Donaldson's use of this device because it was to exactly the depth of understanding I required - deep enough to have a solid grounding in fact, but not so detailed that he wasted twenty-odd pages on mathematical formulae and indecipherable techno-babble. In particular his section on matter cannon has proved incredibly useful in some of my science fiction attempts. It is to my great chagrin, however, that I cannot seem to find anywhere similar documentation regarding the super light proton cannon - matter cannon's bigger sister, as I affectionately rank it. I suppose brining this up in this thread is better than starting an entirely new one for the same purpose, so I may as well put forth the question: How do super light proton cannons work?
Back to my original point in this post (my apologies for drifting so much), I do wonder whether there are any other authors who flesh out their technology with a little scientific reasoning. I know of at least one off-hand who does not resort entirely to the "it's the future, it's maaagic!" =accompanied by mysterious finger-waggling= explanation of the incredible - Larry Niven (it was from he that I learned of Chandraskhar's limit, while explaining neutron stars).
As a matter of fact, is there anyone who thinks this kind of thing is a cop-out? Or are we mostly content to accept things as a given in Sci-Fi, possibly to the extent that we feel such ancillary documentation is needless and, in fact, over-the-top? This is something I would definately enjoy reading some opinions on.
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Post by Loredoctor »

I think it is a cop-out.

As for super light proton cannons, I assumed that they worked via simply accelerating protons to immense speeds (close to speed of light - hence the super light). As you accelerate protons to such speeds they gain mass/energy. Therefore, when the protons strike matter they release this energy, AND if they hit an atomic nucleus they release atomic energy. I assumed this because SRD says that Amnion Defensives can crack open planets.
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Post by kevinswatch »

Yeah, never be shy about bumping old threads. As long as you don't go crazy and bump every thread in the forum...heh. But I think most people here at the Watch prefer that if you want to talk about something that already has a topic about it, to just use the old topic instead of making a new topic.

All I know about singularity grenades is that it made an awesome scene at the end of that one book...heh.-jay
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Post by Nathan »

Super light implies faster than light (super being latin for above).

Probably they'd use an inverted version of the electron guns (used to fire electrons at relatively low speeds) they use in televisions, but how would they produce the lone protons in the first place? That's the thing I wonder about. The super light proton cannon would be more powerful than a super light electron cannon because protons are heavier than electrons.
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Post by The Dreaming »

No, I don't think a near singularity is impossible. There exists in this universe something called a microscopic or mini Black Hole. These are not that massive, but are so tiny and dense they do indeed tear a hole in space time. Now, this is a hole, but the sides (I am speaking assuming that you to are thinking of Hawking's idea of the space-time fabric) of the gravity well are extremely steep. If wee have a 500 kilogram near singularity, it very well could be the size of a cherry pit, or even say, a grain of sand. Perhaps even the nucleus of a uranium atom. It doesn’t matter what size it is, all that matters is density. Density is what determines the strength of a gravity well. The even horizon for said black hole, (or the extent of the gravity well for said near black hole) could be a mere few centimeters outside the mass itself.

Say you were using a condensed lead/iron as your base material (I am hypothesizing fiercely here, just going on what I know) and you could keep it in place with strong electromagnetism (it would only work in zero-g). The chassis was probably mostly just a way of keeping anyone who handled the thing from being caught in the gravity well, as well as a carrier for the said implosion device.
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Post by Sorus »

Tranquil Hegemony wrote:On a side note, what the hell does everyone in this future universe use for power? They sure seem to have solved the energy problem. A matter cannon alone would require VAST amounts of energy, let alone a super-light proton cannon. (And I wonder what a heavy proton cannon would do!)
It was pointed out somewhere that the power consumption of the super-light proton cannon was 'prohibitive'. As it was, I believe, primarily an Amnioni weapon, it is quite possible that they had energy sources beyond the realm of human imagination.

As for singularity grenades, I'd have to agree with Taverner's assessment ( 8O :? don't let that get around) that such things were 'impractical'. The dangers involved with creating, transporting, and using them as a weapon would be prohibitive in the extreme. Though if it could be done, someone would do it. It's an historical fact, and not one that's likely to change in the future.

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Post by Captain Sheep-Flicker »

Maybe they're something along the lines of EE Doc Smiths Negasphere?
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Post by Prebe »

Tranquil Hegemony: Fusion of helium nuclei? I thought fusion was hydrogen colliding to create helium?

My knowledge of particle physics is not what it ought to be btw. So KISD.
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Post by Loredoctor »

Fusion is any merging of nuclei, or the addition of protons/neutrons to nuclei.
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Post by Prebe »

Thanks Loremaster. My question was not phrased correctly as I know the meaning of the word:

It should have been: I thought that the kind of fusion that physics hope to use an energy source was the same as in a neutron bomb (fusion of deuterium nuclei to create helium?). The post by the apparently very well informed Tranquil Hegemony statet an experiment where helium nuclei fused. I just wanted a confirmation that this was not the reaction people normaly think of when they think of fusion as an energy source.
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Post by Loredoctor »

Sorry, Prebe.
I think the common source is deuterium.

BTW, is that Quincy the Doctor as your avatar?
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Post by Prebe »

No need to excuse, I was being unclear.

Yes, it is Quincy the doctor. My great role model. As a kid I wanted to be a pathologist because of him. I completely forgot about it. Then, by a twist of fate, I end up as a forensic geneticist. Not the same, but it smells a bit like the real thing :lol:

Btw. talking of avatars, how do you enter a subheading below your nick?
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Post by Loredoctor »

Prebe wrote:I end up as a forensic geneticist
Respect.
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Go to 'Shop' at the top. Then click on 'Effects'. Then 'buy title' or buy 'username title'. Not sure of which as my title was done by one of the admins. Anyway, here is 7000 wgd to help.
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Post by Prebe »

Thanks for the help (and the bread) Loremaster.
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