PROPER Fantasy Football

[stonemaybe]

Never mind. Reina Gerrard and Cahill had all made a gentleman's agreement that they'd be joining the Stonecerts. Their loss!

-----------------------------Robinson (5.5)---------------------------------

-Chimbonda(5.5)---Terry (8.0)----Campbell (5.0)----Carragher(5.5)--


--Seol (6.0)--------Bowyer (6.0)-------Lampard (11.0)-----Duff (8.5)---


----------------------Keane (9.0)--------Doyle (6.5)-----------------------

Total cost £76.5mil though that changes every time I add up! I may have to look into the Chimbonda situation though, and if he's still adamant he wants a transfer i may refuse to play him and buy Finnan instead (7.5).

[Trapper]

Stonemaybe:

I may be wrong about this, but as far as I'm aware you're still entitled to pick Cahill, Gerrard and Reyna.

I picked King and Berbatov even though I'd already seen them in Queeaquegs side.

Mind you, if you're disgusted with them for playing for two teams, I can't exactly blame you. Where has club loyalty gone these days?

I would have picked Chimbonda myself, but from what I can make out he's created a pretty big rift between himself and the club, not to mention the fans.

[stonemaybe]

I would have picked Chimbonda myself, but from what I can make out he's created a pretty big rift between himself and the club, not to mention the fans.

Exactly. Shame, he played so well last season. Something very likeable about his play too.

As for the 3 turncoats, you're welcome to the mercenaries!

[Trapper]

Stonemaybe:

Unfortunately I don't get to see much EPL these days as I don't have Pay TV. So I only really know Chimbonda by reputation.

I like your side. How did I miss seeing Carragher at 5.5?

Mind you I spent the whole 80.0 so it would have taken some work to get him in over Mellberg.

You must rate Doyle highly to have not spent your remaining 3.5 on somebody else. I noticed you have Seol as well (good value at 6.0). Are you a Reading fan?

[stonemaybe]

You must rate Doyle highly to have not spent your remaining 3.5 on somebody else. I noticed you have Seol as well (good value at 6.0). Are you a Reading fan?

I don't really support one team, so normally go for the underdog or those with Irish players! Girlfriend is Korean and (typically) football-mad so I tend to keep an eye on the Korean players too. I do think Reading are going to score alot of goals this season, as long as they don't get any injuries.

As for watching the footie - Match of the Day and newspapers are my only source!

[Queeaqueg]

It doesn't matter that we have the same player in our teams. If he does well then that is good for both of us. I have also made some updates in the Transfers. I will start puting up points scored after today's Premiership games.

[Trapper]

1 Goalkeepers
4 Defenders
4 Midfielders
2 Strikers

You can put players out of position if you think that they will do better there. You can also change formations, doesn't have to be standard 4-4-2, you can have just one attacker or whatever.

Just realised I missed that first quote in the opening post. D'Oh!

Is my 3-4-3 outside the rules (or even the spirit) of the game?

I'll redo my team if you like, or is this Ok with the players out of position thing. (ie Downing as a defender and Berbatov as an Attacking Midfielder).

Thanks for all your effort by the way. It's a pity there weren't more takers.

[Queeaqueg]

Um... I might throw that rule out because someone might want three strikers. I guess we could because someone might prefer more strikers to midfield.

[A Gunslinger]

No, this is the football that is watch and enjoyed throughout the world, where every nation is involved. You know, the most popular sport in the world.

Yeah, I guess it is just us two. Some others miht join. I will put up a list of players once more trnasfers have gone through.

I think everybody knows that I am somehwat left of moderate, and believe in a global society, bereft of jingoism and cliche. Having said that, I grow weary of the smug piety of the Futball enthusiast who looks down on american football as some sort of bastardized version of rugby.

American football is a sport peerless in its excitement, power, intensity and strategy. Yes, it has not made it to a world market, but who the hell cares? IMO I would hate to water down the talent pool by an influx of athletes whose cultures have told them that touching a ball is bad.

Put that in yer pipe and smoke it!

[Trapper]

IMO I would hate to water down the talent pool by an influx of athletes whose cultures have told them that touching a ball is bad.

Put that in yer pipe and smoke it!

I take it you're talking about the Offensive Linemen in the NFL who can go their entire careers without touching the ball?

Yeah, your sport does have tactical complexity that is not understood by the uninitiated. But it doesn't have freedom of expression. Everybody performs a pre-written role. At least on the Offense. If I am reincarnated as a Grid-Iron player let me at least play Defense. At least then I'll have the chance to express myself, albeit in a limited way.

I prefer to water down my talent pool by prohibiting the use of hands rather than by excluding anybody who is not 6'6", on steroids, and built like a brick shithouse, or alternatively an Olympic Sprinter, on steroids, with a modicum of hand-eye co-ordination.

Feel free to look on me as a figure of pity.

I used to LOVE NFL until I realised how much hype surrounded it. Thanks for Jerry Rice and Emmett Smith, but ...

Oh what's the point...

You probably think Baseball holds a candle to Cricket as well...

How did you do at the last Olympics in Basketball?

Enjoy your "World Champion" NFL teams.

Tip: No one else cares in the slightest.

[Trapper]

It is very cute that you have men in tights genuflecting to themselves in between the "wardrobe malfunctions" though.

You Yanks can be adorable in your own way for those that have a taste for that kind of thing.

I used to.

I don't anymore so...

[A Gunslinger]

Yeah, your sport does have tactical complexity that is not understood by the uninitiated. But it doesn't have freedom of expression. Everybody performs a pre-written role. At least on the Offense. If I am reincarnated as a Grid-Iron player let me at least play Defense. At least then I'll have the chance to express myself, albeit in a limited way.

That is part of the appeal. The precison needed to excell in the game is stellar. All teammates must perform their job in order for the play to work (on offense). Discipline, vision and sheer force of will are requisites.

I prefer to water down my talent pool by prohibiting the use of hands rather than by excluding anybody who is not 6'6", on steroids, and built like a brick shithouse, or alternatively an Olympic Sprinter, on steroids, with a modicum of hand-eye co-ordination.

Feel free to look on me as a figure of pity.

A hasty generalization on your part, buddy. Certainly, your are not pitable to the point where you believe that all American football players fall into your description, do you?

I used to LOVE NFL until I realised how much hype surrounded it. Thanks for Jerry Rice and Emmett Smith, but ...

Oh what's the point...

You probably think Baseball holds a candle to Cricket as well...

How did you do at the last Olympics in Basketball?

Enjoy your "World Champion" NFL teams.

Tip: No one else cares in the slightest.

Sure, there is a lot of hype surrounding the NFL, jsut as you would expect from the world's most exciting sport. I agree that the hype is annoying.... I live with it though, because I love the game. Much the way, I suspect you look disdainfully at the hooligans that always draw attention away from your sport's games by fighting in the stands.

Actually I like cricket a great deal, and think It, rather than major league baseball is the better "bat n' ball" type game. There is a sesnsibility and grace in Cricket that MLB lacks.

I care not for Basketball, but actually I root against the USA in Basketball, as I think it unfair at it's core that we field a team that on paper should mop everybody up. I'm glad they lost.

I do enjoy the World Champions of the NFL. The Superbowl is watched worldwide, my friend...with more and more watching every year.

My friendly advice is to not resent the NFL, instead to enjoy it for its excesses and it grandeur.

[Trapper]

That is part of the appeal. The precison needed to excell in the game is stellar. All teammates must perform their job in order for the play to work (on offense). Discipline, vision and sheer force of will are requisites.

...

A hasty generalization on your part, buddy. Certainly, your are not pitable to the point where you believe that all American football players fall into your description, do you?

That's exactly what I'm saying.

It's not precision that is required to excel.

It's drugs.

(nb I don't think that Lance Armstrong was on drugs, but Floyd Landis recovering in the Mountains like he did was suspect. Phelps is a talented swimmer but the majority of your Olympic medal tally is due to chemicals).

If you think that's a hasty generalization then look at the way most Americans see soccer. I saw some idiot on the Newshour with Jim Lehrer getting angry about how un-American the sport was after the World Cup. He was all irate about how LaCrosse was SOOOO much better and more in tune with American values.

But you're right, I did generalize. Apart from the Wide Receivers and Cornerbacks your sport is in fact populated by people who are between 5'10" and 6'5" who are on steroids. Not 6'6". Amongst the WR's and CB's I can recall only Darrell Green was an Olympic Class sprinter.

The only guys under 5'9" I recall making any kind of career in American sports IIRC were Muggsy Bogues and Spud Webb in the NBA. Kudos to them, but to my mind that's a pretty sad indictment of US sport.

When I lived in Georgia there was a QB called Tracey Hamm at Georgia Southern who broke all kinds of Collegiate records. But he was only 6'2" so when he graduated he went to Edmonton in the Canadian League. Too short for the NFL.

Every sport is basically about footwork. Even boxing, which is about as hand-oriented as it gets. For example, I remember my snooker game going downhill when I wasn't positioning my feet correctly. Who woulda thunk it?

So it stands to reason that a sport which requires extra footwork necessitates extra skill. That's why I'm glad that players such as Maradona weren't ruled out of the World Game by their diminutive stature.

If you don't like our game, that's fine.

But note that you're posting on this thread.

I've read through the FF thread on your sport. I didn't feel compelled to post.

If I haven't made my point clear in the above comments:

US sport is riddled with drugs and rightfully laughed at by the rest of the World.

You should take up Sumo. Y'all'd be good at that.

I do enjoy the World Champions of the NFL. The Superbowl is watched worldwide, my friend...with more and more watching every year.

My friendly advice is to not resent the NFL, instead to enjoy it for its excesses and it grandeur.

More and more watching each year, eh? I'll take your word for that.

The excesses and self-proclaimed grandeur are precisely why I don't watch it anymore.

But no offense meant. Hell, I'm even enjoying this discussion. Far more than I ever will US sport at the very least.

Tiger, Fred Couples, and Michelle Wie have nice golf swings. I'll give you that.

[A Gunslinger]

That's exactly what I'm saying.

It's not precision that is required to excel.

Among the professional sports, the NFL actually tries to assure that their players are not on steroids. American Baseball is terrible ..only now are they really starting to go after it...but in the NFL, teams are required to test players AND the league tests randomly. Additionally, the sanctions are terrible. If one is suspended they lose game salary. When you are paid only 20 weeks out of the year , a game check or 4 or 6, or whatever, is HUGE. I am not saying that some players have not found a way to beat the system...I DO know that the vast majority of players in American football do not take steroids. Additionally, the affect on a body taking steroids nearly precludes use by NFL players. Use of steroids causes the body breaks down at joints, and at ligament attachments. The forceful contact needed to play the sport would mean CONSTANT injury to antyone taking such drugs, and therefore a very short and unlucrative career.

American footbal does require precision on every play to make any given play a success. Each player on the Offensive line has to creat or fill a gap, the backfield must block or go to a specific designed gap, the QB must either hand off the ball or read the defense qucikly to throw the ball to a spot on the field where the play mandates a receiver to be (and must make the throw before the receiver actually is there, mind you). It is timing and precision and effort. This is to say nothing of the toughness it takes to play.

As the size and speed of the game increases, the contact gets more violent. Hit and Hit back. I mean, save for the recievers who try to avoid contact and the kickers (who need not be all that strong and fast), of course, everyone else must expect to keep their wits and strength up.

If you think that's a hasty generalization then look at the way most Americans see soccer. I saw some idiot on the Newshour with Jim Lehrer getting angry about how un-American the sport was after the World Cup. He was all irate about how LaCrosse was SOOOO much better and more in tune with American values.

I make no apologies for some yahoo that had a camera thrown in front of him. Don't paint us all with the same brush, pal. My only point, which you have demnonstrated, albeit eloqunetly enough, was that how I tire of the self-sanctimony and elitism of the futball enthusiast who looks down their nose at football as somehow less of a sport. Clearly, some who do this do not understand the game at all.

Amongst the WR's and CB's I can recall only Darrell Green was an Olympic Class sprinter.

Most men who pay at CB and WR run a 4.3 to 4.6 40 yard dash. Pretty speedy.

The only guys under 5'9" I recall making any kind of career in American sports IIRC were Muggsy Bogues and Spud Webb in the NBA. Kudos to them, but to my mind that's a pretty sad indictment of US sport.

Would you say the same if a man wished to be a horse jockey, but he weighed 175 and stood 5.9" ? Clearly he would lose an advantage by weighing down the horse, and could not race effectively. The fact that most men in the NFL are large is not an indictment on the sprt, but a comment on the fact that the bigger and faster a team is, it is less likely a shorter man can be effective. What do you want...height quotas?

When I lived in Georgia there was a QB called Tracey Hamm at Georgia Southern who broke all kinds of Collegiate records. But he was only 6'2" so when he graduated he went to Edmonton in the Canadian League. Too short for the NFL.

Too short for the NFL? Maybe, but how do explain one Doug Flutie who in lifts was barely taller than Jiminy Cricket? No I'd say it proabably had more to do with the fact that Ham was from a po-dunk Division III school that ran a variation on the "wishbone" offense. This offense does not yield a decent skill set that translates to the NFL. Perhaps his arm wasn't as strong as was needed. But, I would bet the pro teams did evaluate him...I mean if he went to canada to play, he would have been looked at.

So it stands to reason that a sport which requires extra footwork necessitates extra skill. That's why I'm glad that players such as Maradona weren't ruled out of the World Game by their diminutive stature.

If there were a sport that required sweeping generalizations, you'd be ALL-WORLD, my friend. Skills are different per sport. There isn't a lot of footwork in playing Billiards, but I'd say that there is plenty of skill on display in watching some of the greats play.

If you don't like our game, that's fine.

But note that you're posting on this thread.

Like I said earlier, it not the game I don't like. It lacks a certain zest, but it is a great game for high schools to keep the kids busy until football season in the fall, and I have watched a few games in my time, and had fun. My problem was when I saw the title of the thread (Proper ..Football), I had to check to see if the author was one of the smug, pious weenies that turns people off to futball.

US sport is riddled with drugs and rightfully laughed at by the rest of the World.

You should take up Sumo. Y'all'd be good at that.

Again, the generalizations. I urge you to look at our own "Album" thread. I think you might be saying that americans are fat. We at the watch are a pretty fit bunch, fella.

But no offense meant. Hell, I'm even enjoying this discussion. Far more than I ever will US sport at the very least.

None taken...I too enjoy a quick run up and down the field heading and kicking arguments around. Hell, it seems that I am qualified to play futball, given the desire and my height! Wheeee!

[/quote]

[Queeaqueg]

Are you joining in or should I ask this to be moved to the Tank?

I really don't care wherever you think your football is better then our football. When I read your argument, it seems to me that you think your football came first and out one was just some bad rip-off. Here our a few points:
1. Soccer/Football is played throughout the World, even by the US. It is the most popular sport ever with everyone playing and talking about it.
2. Football makes billions every year. The Premiership not only makes more money then any other league but it is the most watch league throughout the world.
3. Football is good because you need skill in every area; speed, strength, agility, etc. Not only that but you need tactics and ways to break down the opponent.
4. I watch American Football and I would rather watch Rugby, at least that involves more skill.

Now shut up and get back to the game!

[A Gunslinger]

Are you joining in or should I ask this to be moved to the Tank?

I really don't care wherever you think your football is better then our football. When I read your argument, it seems to me that you think your football came first and out one was just some bad rip-off. Here our a few points:
1. Soccer/Football is played throughout the World, even by the US. It is the most popular sport ever with everyone playing and talking about it.
2. Football makes billions every year. The Premiership not only makes more money then any other league but it is the most watch league throughout the world.
3. Football is good because you need skill in every area; speed, strength, agility, etc. Not only that but you need tactics and ways to break down the opponent.
4. I watch American Football and I would rather watch Rugby, at least that involves more skill.

Now shut up and get back to the game!

I don't know how you possibly could have drawn the conclusion that I thought American football came first. I suggest you read my argument a bit more closely. I don't know what it is about you futball enthusiasts and your unswerving ability to either a) make smug sweeping generalizations or b) create assumptions out of thin air, but I must say it is a trifle annoying. For the record, I am well aware the history of Futball. Note I do not call it "soccer", which I thought you and yours would appreciate.

Again, I will state, and please read it as many times as you need to this time, that it is not the sport that I find regrettable in it's lack of substance. No, it is the smug, elite assurances by futball ethusiasts that American football is somehow for plebians or bereft of value that I find so.

Let me adress your points:

1) Again, I am well aware that futball is played worldwide. Great. I'm not entirely sure what you mean by the second sentence...your sentence construction suggests that everyone who plays it thinks it is the greatest sport ever. But, I think you might ean that world wide teeming masses are constantly agog over the sport. In any event, I won't argue that.

2) Futball I am sure makes billions every year. The NFL is no piker, my friend the economic impact of the Superbowl ALONE is thought to be in the neighborhood of 600 million. This does not include any regular season revenue, merchandise, etc. Even though it does not have as wide an audience (yet) , it still generates more than a billion, probably closer to 2 B when all is said and done. Not shabby considering that the audience is smaller (but growing every year).

3) You seem to be describing American Football as well. Certainly you would not suggest otherwise after watching some games.

4) I think perhaps you should invest some time in watching a few NFL games before making any judgements on the relative skills needed. To suggest that skills are not needed is daft, if not downright unbecoming of an individual claiming to be a lover of sport.

Your mate on this thread at least is respectful and well-mannered in enjoying this discussion. You, my pompous pal, have not been so. For my part I apologize for taking your thread off-track. You may return to your PROPER Fantasy futball, and I will return to my "Proper" Fantasy Football.

[Queeaqueg]

Good! Now get lost.

You're the pompous idiot, you have taken something which was meant to be fun and turned it into a stupid argument which will not be resolved because we are both convinced that our football is better. You don't see me or the others going to Fantasy Football thread and rant on about how Soccer/Football is better while saying yours is crap. The title 'Proper Fantasy Football' was just a silly joke, don't see any other American football fans coming here and ranting.

Now you can join in if you want to but if you have just come to argue, can we at least set up a different thread for it or (now this is a very radical idea) not do it at all.

[Trapper]

Sorry Queeaqueg.

It was my fault for biting so hard on the bait.

I do that sometimes.

It was fun A Gunslinger, but I'll leave it there.

Let's just enjoy our own games.

[A Gunslinger]

Sorry Queeaqueg.

It was my fault for biting so hard on the bait.

I do that sometimes.

It was fun A Gunslinger, but I'll leave it there.

Let's just enjoy our own games.

Sounds good to me Trap...your buddy Queeg is a wound a bit tight. See you on the watch!

[stonemaybe]

Right! Fantasy Football!

After this weekend's dismal showing by the Stonecerts, I've remembered why I haven't played fantasy football in a few years - as soon as I pick a player, he goes from great to non-entity! From the back...

Mr. Robinson in goals let in two pathetic goals - one from his own defender , and though Andy Johnson did well for the second, it really should have been a straightforward save!

Pascal Chimbonda came on as a substitute, so at least he will play. Not that he did anything when he did come on!

Carragher didn't even play.

Campbell's team play tonight.

Terry - not TOO bad a display. Kept a clean sheet and was fouled for a penalty.

Seol was invisible. But he did manage to get booked somehow!

Bowyer wasn't invisible, just sh*t. Missed quite an easy chance at the end to give his team a draw.

Lampard scored the penalty earned by Terry. Not a bad performance but not up to his normal standard.

Duff had a quiet game. A couple of shots didn't trouble their goalie.

Doyle again invisible.

Keane now thinks he is a midfielder playmaker instead of a striker. Hence when he had a good chance at the end, fluffed it wide. This may be because I made him captain of the Stonecerts. may have to re-consider.

All in all, a very disappointing display from my lads.

Anyone know a good sports psychologist or drug-dealer?