Esmer

Post by **Endymion9** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 6:04 pm

I'm confused. How did he get the power to overcome white gold (by stopping its use?). The elohim don't seem to have this power and he's not even full elohim.

Seems out of character to the series for anything to trump White Gold.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 6:13 pm

the way I read those passages is that Esmer does not affect the White Gold, rather he somehow can prevent Linden's access to it.

Post by **MsMary** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 6:27 pm

Which section are we talking about here?

Post by **Relayer** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 6:39 pm

The Seventh Ward wrote:the way I read those passages is that Esmer does not affect the White Gold, rather he somehow can prevent Linden's access to it.

That's how I understand it. IIRC it has something to do w/ his conflicted Elohim/Haruchai nature that messes w/ Linden. Or at least that's what *she* thinks it is.

Post by **dlbpharmd** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 7:23 pm

Linden needs her health sense to access wild magic, and Kevin's Dirt blocks her health sense. So, it seems to me, that Esmer exerts a Dirt-like effect on Linden whenever he's close to her. I believe he has this ability since he was the one who created Kevin's Dirt (along with Kastanessen.)

Post by **Endymion9** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 7:28 pm

dlbpharmd wrote:Linden needs her health sense to access wild magic, and Kevin's Dirt blocks her health sense. So, it seems to me, that Esmer exerts a Dirt-like effect on Linden whenever he's close to her. I believe he has this ability since he was the one who created Kevin's Dirt (along with Kastanessen.)

Ah, that would make sense. Thanks,

Post by **Relayer** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 7:28 pm

That's a good point, dlb. Maybe the Dirt arises directly from his nature. The difference may only be in magnitude... the Dirt blocks healthsense, while Esmer makes Linden feel nauseous (but apparently no one else).

Post by **Endymion9** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 7:28 pm

MsMary wrote:Which section are we talking about here?

I was referring to any of the sections on ROTE and FR where Linden cannot access White Gold due to Esmer's pressense.

Post by **Zarathustra** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 11:34 pm

Relayer wrote:
The Seventh Ward wrote:the way I read those passages is that Esmer does not affect the White Gold, rather he somehow can prevent Linden's access to it.
That's how I understand it. IIRC it has something to do w/ his conflicted Elohim/Haruchai nature that messes w/ Linden. Or at least that's what *she* thinks it is.

I agree.

Post by **lurch** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 12:23 am

Endymion9 wrote:I'm confused. How did he get the power to overcome white gold (by stopping its use?). The elohim don't seem to have this power and he's not even full elohim.

Seems out of character to the series for anything to trump White Gold.

AAHH!,,Confusion is good.. There is an observation you've made that seems to me..a bit off. The " out of character to the series"...uuummm..How did the 2nd Chrons end?..TC actually gave it up,, disengaged himself from it. While not in the easily perceived sense,,TC trumped the allure, the trap,,of the White Gold , Lord Foul was sooo counting on...so think of it in that sense and apply to Esmer.

What is Esmer?,,besides the offspring of the stoic and the wanton?..or because he IS the offspring of the polar opposites,,Esmer is basically a MYSTERY,,hence your question. Take a step back,, polar opposites in conflict..what trumps both and the conflict between them? What Trumps the adamant positioning of both and either diametrically opposed?..I've already told you....MYSTERY...The Unknown..TC Trumped Lord Foul with the Unknown and took his place as the Arch keeping Foul forever stymied. Esmer is the same..a mystery, THE MYSTERY,, MYSTERY ITSELF..The UNKNOWN ITSELF..never knowing what hes up to or going to do..MYSTERY. His POTENTIAL stymies the hot passion of an Extreme Positioning...white gold. Linden should make Love with Esmer.

Post by **Ur Dead** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 4:21 am

Esmer affects Linden with a feeling of sickness. It churns her stomuch. That is the impression I got when reading ROTE. She can't look fully at Esmer with her health sense.

So with a few carefully placed lies, Esmer states that she can't use the White Gold when he is present. (ROTE)

and Linden believes him. So it become a self fullfilling prophecy and fact. That is until Linden overcomes her doubt and slaps the crap out of him.

Post by JD » Sat Feb 16, 2008 12:25 am

Its not that Lindeen is taking Esmer's word at face value, when she tried to access the White Gold when the Skurg attacked she had no idea Esmer was there. She got quesy and then he appeared blocking her from using the wild magic. Then she saw what Liand was doing with the staff and grabbed that and used the storm to drench the skurg.

Post by **Bran Pendragon** » Sun Feb 17, 2008 11:47 am

So overall, after FR, how are people feeling about Esmer in general terms - like the character or dislike him (I mean as an enjoyable character, not as whether you think he's a good guy or not).

I thought he was sort of cool in Runes, but by the end of FR I was a bit over his whole help/harm back-and-forth. Would be quite happy for Linden to blast him out of existence with Wild Magic (once she works out how to get past the nausea thing he causes). "What's that, you can't help wanting to try and kill me because your mummy was messed up, and now you want to look beseechingly at me like its not your fault?. Ok then. Goodnight" ZZZZAAPPP!!

Post by **ninjaboy** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 6:30 am

I don't think Esmer deliberately blocks of her access to the White Gold though.. And even if he DOES, is he going to be able to block Covenant's access to it??

The ring is his anyway, surely...

Anyway I like Esmer.. And Esmer seems to be one of the few people (aside from Roger) who would / can defend her from the Harrow.. LA should really heal him with that staff though..

Post by **emotional leper** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 6:45 am

ninjaboy wrote:I don't think Esmer deliberately blocks of her access to the White Gold though.. And even if he DOES, is he going to be able to block Covenant's access to it??

The ring is his anyway, surely...

Anyway I like Esmer.. And Esmer seems to be one of the few people (aside from Roger) who would / can defend her from the Harrow.. LA should really heal him with that staff though..

I don't think it's any more possible to 'fix' Esmer without killing him than it is to seperate TC from the Wild Magic.

Post by **Seppi2112** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 7:47 am

Yeah, I agree. Esmer IS the contradiction, he's not burdened with it in the same way Anele is.

Post by **ninjaboy** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 9:32 am

Anyway I can't forsee an ending to the series where esmer isn't 'fixed' - one way or the other...

Post by **emotional leper** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 1:31 pm

ninjaboy wrote:Anyway I can't forsee an ending to the series where esmer isn't 'fixed' - one way or the other...

He may die, but I seriously doubt the contradictory nature of his being ever being fixed. It is who he is.

Post by **DukkhaWaynhim** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 2:27 pm

Unless by 'fixed' you can simply mean that he becomes a little more confortable with the contradiction built into his nature - similar to Covenant's embracing the paradox of the white gold to become it fully.

dw

Post by **wayfriend** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 2:40 pm

Well, I for one don't agree that Esmer blocking the white gold is anything like Kevin's Dirt. Because Esmer's effect doesn't do anything else - if just blocks access to white gold in one person - nothing else related to health sense is affected, and not in anyone else. Also, health sense is a prerequisite for Linden, and Kevin's Dirt affects that prerequisite -- but Esmer blocks access to the thing itself.

I think Esmer's effect has more to do with the inherent irreconcilability between wild magic and Lawful Earthpower. He somehow tips Linden into the Earthpower side.

If the krill can, as Linden thinks, allow one to use the Staff and the ring at the same time, then Esmer may have lost a weapon.

Kevin's Watch

Kevin's Watch

Esmer

Esmer

Re: Esmer