Hellfire and Bloody Damnation

Post by **Landwaster** » Mon Nov 18, 2002 4:30 am

TC said 'bloody' a lot, but I thought that was a rarely employed adjective in the USA. TC was definitely meant to be in the US, so ... am I wrong to think it unusual he'd say bloody this and bloody that? Are there areas of the US which use this slang? Might this assist in determining where abouts Bigotville was meant to be located?

Post by **duchess of malfi** » Mon Nov 18, 2002 5:14 am

People don't say that in my part of the country. Donaldson might just be polite in saying bloody hell and things of that nature rather than what some Americans actually say when they're very upset. And no, I can't say them in a family forum, but think of one of the products of this part of the country, Eminem, and you'll understand.

I'm not sure about other parts of the country, maybe some Midwesterners are just more pottymouthed. (you should hear some of the things that come out of the mouths of some of the kids in my son's middle school

)

Post by **Landwaster** » Mon Nov 18, 2002 5:34 am

Well its a VERY common comment in Australia ('bloody hell'), or at least it has been until the last 15 or so years, since when most youth have more or less taken on American terminology. So if its common here, it probably came from the UK, and some of the USA's eastern states I have heard still have a bit of the UK about them ... so maybe that's where he's aiming.

On top of that, if he spent time in the sub-continent with his Dad, SRD may have been exposed to the English there (I dunno when their control of the area dissipated.

Its always had me wondering, nevertheless. It is meant to be indicative of the locale, or is it just something SRD was aware of, and wished to implement if he could for the simple fact that he thought it sounded amusing and individual?

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon Nov 18, 2002 7:23 pm

Not sure about the word "bloody", but they use a lot of old fashioned words and names in the Appalacian Mountains area. That would sort of fit with the religious fundamentalism and the good 'ol boy sherriff, too. When I visit my relatives there I can't figure out some of the things they're saying. It's not just a different regional accent -- it's entire words they use that I'm unfamiliar with. One of my aunts is names Jerusiah. I thought that was just an old family name until I ran across it in a book about colonial times. The people who live in the mountains have kept all sorts of old, kind of interesting stuff alive.

Post by **Lord Mhoram** » Mon Nov 18, 2002 8:04 pm

We dont say it over here...

Post by **[Syl]** » Tue Nov 19, 2002 4:28 am

don't know about "bloody," but vituperatives like damnation and hellfire are common in the rural west.

Post by **Landwaster** » Tue Nov 19, 2002 6:25 am

Yeah its mainly 'bloody' that I was talking about. We don't say Hellfire nor damnation here much.

Its probably just some exposure to brits or aussies that gave SRD the idea to use the terminology.

Post by **Skyweir** » Tue Nov 19, 2002 6:28 am

I'm not sure SRD particularly cares to be seen as 'polite' in his writing .. nor even bow to religous fundamentalist or social etiquette .. TCTC and the Gap would affirm that imo ..

I think he wrote TC as an average kinda guy who isnt profane per se .. but is normal in every other way .. so he uses expletives like bloody hell .. and hellfire .. and damnation .. Maybe even to SRD these choices of vocabulary are meant to give TC that aggressive shock value .. needed to demonstrate his deep embittered feelings about all that life has given him to deal with .. his leperosy .. his wife's abandonment .. his communities rejection of him .. his absolute alienation from most human associations of any kind ..

bloody hell .. like many expletives .. or more aptly 'vituperatives'

.. seem to us outsiders to be frowned on in American cultural norms re: social etiquette .. but are indeed widely accepted and used in other cultures ie: English and Australian .. to us buggar and bloody are very tame uses of profanity .. and barely even qualify here as profane ..

I dont think SRD is at all 'religous' and everything I have read of him and by him .. seem to me to reflect his distrust of organised religion and what he seems to see as hyprocritical standards of the self-righteous or the 'pietistic' ..

I do think SRD has great reverence for spirituality .. and it would seem he values this above all organised and institutionalised religous conventions ..

TC uses hellfire .. and bloody a lot .. no doubt for its impact on the reader .. maybe a tool to describe Covenant .. and illustrate more fully his persona ..

Post by **kaseryn** » Tue Nov 19, 2002 9:34 am

Personally, i love it.. cos its such a familiar word for me. The contradiction hadn't occurred to me before, but now that u mention it, bloody hell yeah

Post by **Landwaster** » Tue Nov 19, 2002 10:47 am

LOL @ 'bloody hell yeah' ... good alloy ... ('bloody hell' being most popular in Australia and 'hell yeah' being most popular in the USA).

In fact, while on messageboards or in chatrooms in future, I'm gonna type HABD whenever something surprises or frustrates me.

... or not ... we'll see how long my new fad lasts

Post by **High Lord Prothall** » Sat Nov 23, 2002 3:46 am

I believe that "bloody" is generally used more in England, since it's common in books by English authors. Probably not the vernacular in Bigotville USA.

"Hellfire" is another expletitive that I've never heard in speech before. "Hell" of course is used quite often, but never "Hellfire" Maybe in the deep south?

Post by **lillianrill** » Sat Nov 23, 2002 10:38 pm

i think TC must've been an aussie...

you mean think about it..."bloody", the truckie, the poisonous snake..?

sorry to steal it from you Americans!

but he was an aussie at heart! haven't you guys seen the crocodile hunter?

Post by **danlo** » Sun Nov 24, 2002 3:05 am

Crikey, mate! Drop that Steve bozo straight in2 a bubling ur-vile shaping caldron @ the bottom of the deepest pit under Gravin Threndor!! (his wife's a cutey tho..)

Post by **Lord Mhoram** » Sun Nov 24, 2002 2:46 pm

No way SRD would put Covenant in any country other then the good ol' U S of A!

Post by **Landwaster** » Sun Nov 24, 2002 9:32 pm

Yep its true that 'bloody' originated in England.

If he'd been an Aussie then when he first saw Lena, instead of just noting she was pretty, he would've though "Fwoar! She's noyyyyyce."

And if he'd been from England it might have been closer to "{censored} out for the lads!"

(scruples don't translate well to the Land)

Post by **fightingmyinstincts** » Wed Dec 04, 2002 9:04 pm

Maybe TC was just trying to be different? I have my own personal expletives you won't hear much...just because they're not as jaded, and I have a lot to cuss about....I guess TC did too, so maybe no ordinary profanity would do? "For when your everyday profanity just isn't enough, try it -~-CoVeNaNt StYlE!1!-~-

Post by **Bannor** » Thu Dec 05, 2002 1:43 pm

Several fanciful derivations are suggested for this expletive, that is a corruption of "By our Lady", or associated with "bloods" or aristocratic rowdies; but the obvious meaning of the word with its unpleasant and lurid associations is a sufficient explanation of its origin and its use as an intensive.
"It was bloody hot walking today." Swift: Journal to Stella, letter xxii

Source: Brewers Dictionary of Phrase and Fable 1981

Post by **aTOMiC** » Fri Jan 09, 2004 1:45 pm

Oh Bloody Hell!

Kevin's Watch

Kevin's Watch

Hellfire and Bloody Damnation

Hellfire and Bloody Damnation

re