Fatal Revenant Part 1, Ch 3 - Love and Strangers

[kevinswatch]

(I'm reminded of the theme song from Married with Children, Love and Marriage. Perhaps that is where SRD got the idea for this chapter title from? Hm......)

Anyway, I'm sorry for being late and I'm sorry even more for what is destined to be a horrible dissection. Horrible enough to question my status as webmaster of Kevin's Watch. But, I'll do what I can.

So, I have just recently finished Part 1 of FR...which means that I have no idea what happens in Part 2 (besides for a few hints that I've accidentally allowed spoiled to myself). And here I am, spending time now going BACKWARDS in the book. Will I EVER finish Fatal Revenant??? SRD, have mercy on me!

Anyway, let's get this popsicle stand on a roll.

So, as we last left Linden, she was having a confusing conversation with Esmer. (Although, are any conversations with Esmer not confusing?) Linden was left utterly confused with the whole "Drink the Earthblood" thing, although she would have been much better informed if she had read "The Illearth War" instead of spending all of her free time watching reality TV programming on MTV and VH1.

The ur-viles and Waynhim that were chilling with Esmer leave, but we never find out where to. Those damn mysterious Demondim-spawn.

There is a storm approaching, but luckily, this is one of those happy, natural storms. Not one of those crazy, metaphorical death storms that SRD is so fond of. Although it just occurred to me that I wasn't quite aware of the fact that Linden's health-sense is capable of detecting metaphors in weather patterns. That could be quite handy. It sure beats finding a picture of a bunny rabbit in the clouds.

But Linden quickly forgets about that and starts to obsess over priority number one: why won't Covenant and Jeremiah let her touch them? And why won't Esmer simply tell her what's the deal? Oh right, he's an ass. So she decides that she's ready to confront Covenant and make him tell her what's the deal. Although why she thinks he'll tell her what's the deal, God only knows.

"How had the man whom she had loved here, in this very place, become a being who could not tolerate the affirmation of Law?"

Um...are you asking me that, Linden? It beats the heck out of me. Maybe it's another metaphor. Those crazy metaphors.

"She had loved him and her son too long and too arduously to be treated as nothing more than a hindrance."

Have you heard of THOOLAH before, Linden? Er, never mind.

By the way, I'm sure this has been discussed before in multiple topics elsewhere, but what's the deal with Linden always referring to Thomas Covenant as "Covenant"? She calls the man that she loves by the last name? That's a bit too X-filesy.

But first............she wants to talk to the Mahdoubt, although why, God only knows. Linden seems to have an unhealthy obsession with asking people who know more than her questions that she knows they will not answer for her.

"The older woman had been kind to Linden"

Jeez Linden. I know you've been abused and everything, but no need to get all excited over someone being nice to you.

So...blah blah blah Ramen. Blah blah blah Glimmermere.

She has a discussion with Mahrtiir about how awesome Glimmermere is and about how all of there friends are doing it, and so they should do it to, but for the life of me I don't know why she makes such a big deal to tell this before Stave shows up. Unless SRD said so explicitly and I'm simply in too much of a rush to catch it. Or maybe I'm just forgetting something. Or I'm just slow in general. Maybe she's just afraid that he's going to nark on her Glimmermereing good time. Or maybe she's just a jerk. She's already proved in Runes that she doesn't care what Stave thinks.

"Did he see her accurately? Had she in fact gleaned something sacramental from the lake?"

Ok, ok, I get it, clean, metaphor.

So let's see, blah blah, oh wait...

"Do they suffice against the Teeth of the Render?"

Now that's a cool phrase.

Wait...Linden killed the coolness...

Stave: "If the spirit of Kastenessen is able to possess our companion Anele, much is explained."

"Our companion - Linden could not remember hearing Stave speak the old man's name before."

Oh jeez, way to ruin the coolness with a Disney moment.

Wait a minute...

"Esmer has been altered by your return to the Land."

I missed that before. Where the heck did that idea come from?

Damn, I forgot how long this chapter was... Ok, let's skip forward a bit since the Ramen bore me. Oh wait, one more important piece of information from Linden...

"Foul still has my son."

Ah, I missed hearing that phrase like a billion times during Runes.

Oh, and the Mahdoubt has mysteriously left Revelstone. Since she's mysterious, it only makes sense that she travels mysteriously.

Oh, and apparently the Masters suck at being masters, since they have no idea what the hell skurj are. Isn't that technically false advertising? Sue! Sueee!!!

Alright, now we get to the fun part. Enter Thomas Covenant.

And........he's drunk.

He's sort of become the Al Bundy of the Land. (Hm...another Married with Children connection... I think I'm onto something...)

"You should try it. It may help you relax. You're so tense it hurts to look at you."

Don't do it, Linden!!! Don't give into the peer pressure! D.A.R.E.!

Ok, so I didn't realize how late it was, so I'm going to have to give a quick rundown of all of the stuff that pops up in this chapter. And it's a lot. So I'm sure I missed some stuff:

-Drunk Covenant = Fun
-Linden Bashing = Fun
-Jerk Covenant = Fun
-Drunk Covenant + Linden Bashing + Jerk Covenant = Fun for the whole family
-Barek Tapestry = A great way for Drunk Covenant to rant
-Ur-viles = Evil
-Waynhim (Waynhims? Waynhimii?) = Also evil
-Manacles = For Covenant
-Jeremiah = Possibly not shot, but who knows
-Covenant = Knows everything, but not really, especially when it's important to the story
-Kassenessen = One angry SOB
-Joan = One crazy B
-Staff of Law = Crap
-Going to Andelain = Horrible, terrible idea
-White Gold Ring = Covenant's, so give it back to him now

Whew! Now that's a chapter. Sorry I didn't do it any justice. But I ran out of time. I'm sure you all will do a lot better discussing it. Happy dissecting!-jay

[Brasidas]

A unique interpretation! I never realised there was so much comedy in the Chrons!

[dlbpharmd]

A unique interpretation! I never realised there was so much comedy in the Chrons!

Jay's dissections are always hilarious! Thanks Jay!

By the way, I'm sure this has been discussed before in multiple topics elsewhere, but what's the deal with Linden always referring to Thomas Covenant as "Covenant"? She calls the man that she loves by the last name? That's a bit too X-filesy.

Linden has always called TC "Covenant." I can't think of an instance where she calls him "Tom" or "Thomas." In fact, now that I think about it, the only person who ever called him "Tom" was Joan.

[kevinswatch]

I'll be the first to admit that this one wasn't my best work. I think I was too rushed. My previous dissection was much more epic. It's a shame too, since there is so much to work with in this chapter.

Linden has always called TC "Covenant." I can't think of an instance where she calls him "Tom" or "Thomas." In fact, now that I think about it, the only person who ever called him "Tom" was Joan.

Yeah, I know that, but it's still a little strange. I mean, I know there are people out there who refer to other people by their last name, and people who prefer their last name, but using that name for your lover?

-jay

[earthbrah]

Wow, Dissection: The Lighter Side. I like it!

This chapter was my favorite of the first three in FR, mainly because of the conversation between TC and Linden. The title itself says plenty about the feeling and tone that comes across in their conversation and in Linden's reaction to it. These two men are the loves of her life, and yet they both come off as strangers to her. Her heart-shattering reunion in chapter one was given a private stage in this chapter. Her feelings of loss and confusion became reinforced.

Quote:
"How had the man whom she had loved here, in this very place, become a being who could not tolerate the affirmation of Law?"

Though this quote references Glimmermere, it also speaks of her utter dismay and confusion about the way TC and Jeremiah responded to her in chapter one. And law is talked about in their conversation.

TC says, "Damn it, Linden, if you hadn't taken my ring and made that Staff, I would have been able to fix everything ages ago." .... "I'm still trying to clean up your mess."

Wow, what a sonofabitch. He makes a mockery of the healing and beneficence she enacted at the end of WGW, invalidates her own power by way of faulting her for creating the Staff. Worse, "he held her responsible--?" Shame on you, TC!

And yet she remembers his words to her from her dreams: You need the Staff of Law. And of course, this only confuses her more intensely. Even during my first read, I could tell that she had her suspicions, that SRD wanted us to know that she did, but like me, I don't think she knew exactly what they were. She was suspicious, but it didn't have any specific form. Something was wrong; though her health sense couldn't penetrate either of them, something more fundamental was subconsciously exerting itself: her intuition.

TC himself is disaffirming law in more than one sense by making her out to be responsible for the Land's fate. It's not just the Staff-wielded Law that he's disaffirming, he's rocking the very law/foundation of her experiences, of what she knows to be true. He is telling her the opposite of what she expects to hear. She's caught in an inner whorl of anger and confusion due to the bizarre juxtaposition of the man before her, and her memories and convictions. And yet, "nevertheless the discrepancy between her recollections and his attitudes helped her to regain her balance....For the present, she stood her ground." She's finding her own eye of her own paradoxical situation: She has back the two people who mean most to her, but is essentially refused by both of them. But somehow, the opposing natures of her memories and the man before her give her a middle ground on which to stand. She can't move very far from there, but she's standing.



There's of course much more to slice and dice in this chapter, but I must move on for now. I'll be back...

[kevinswatch]

Yeah, I agree that Covenant is basically a huge SOB in this chapter. And I loved the part where he basically blamed Linden for everything, heh.

Although, here's something that I thought about while reading it the first time:

Spoiler

When I was reading the first time, I knew that it was pretty obvious that "Covenant" would turn out to be someone other than Covenant. However, in the back of my mind, I was sort of hoping that a good twist by SRD would be to have this actually be the *real* Covenant all along. To sort of go along with that really old interview of SRD where he said something along the lines of Covenant becoming Foul in the Land Chronicles. Personally, I thought it would have been cool and interesting to see the real Covenant act this way, bitter and pissy after centuries of being the Arch of Time.

-jay

[SoulBiter]

There is alot here that doesnt make sense to me.

TC says, "Damn it, Linden, if you hadn't taken my ring and made that Staff, I would have been able to fix everything ages ago." .... "I'm still trying to clean up your mess."

That one statement has so many innaccuracies in it. Has being a part of the arch of time changed him so much?

1. If you hadnt taken my ring.

First Thomas Covenant gave her the ring.

From WGW -

"I'm sorry."..."I didn't know what else to do. I had to stop him."
Now it's your turn. Pick up the ring. I can't do it myself. I don't have your hands - can't touch that kind of power any more. I'm not physically alive."

and remember that if she hadnt taken the ring when she did, then Findail would have

Chosen withhold! Do not dare the ring! Findail was scarcely a step from the ring. Vain could not hold him back.

But the Appointed did not reach it.

Linden grasped Covenant’s wedding band with the thin remains of her health-sense, drew fire spouting like an affirmation out of the metal. It was her ring now, granted to her in love and necessity;

and made that Staff, I would have been able to fix everything ages ago

So now he is saying that she shouldnt have made the staff? But he told her to do it.

"All I did was stop him. I haven't healed anything. The Sunbane is still there. It has a life of its own. And the Earthpower's been too badly corrupted. It can't recover by itself."

She needed the staff of law to fix the land. There was no other way to do it

Sun-Sage and ring-wielder, she restored the Earthpower and released it over the wracked body of the Land.

Man.. I couldnt wait for TC to come back and now I find that I dont like him much anymore.

[Cleburne]

Jay I must say I like your dissection it was fun and brezzy.nicely done I half way through reading chapter and I want to finish it before I make any major comments.
I agree with Soulbiter when I read the chapter the first time I found TC contradicted himself and he was extremly cool and malicious towards Linden, I couldnt understand his problem, shouldnt he be happy to see her does he still have feelings for her cause I dont remember him saying I missed you or anything to that extent.
One other thing I remember I liked about the chapter is that Stave and the Mahrtir really show their respect for Linden and at least she knows now that she has their trust. I hope that made sense

[earthbrah]

Soulbiter, your reaction to statements like I quoted are much like my own were.

TC's entire purpose in the Second Chronicles centered around replacing the Staff of Law that he inadvertantly destroyed. So it really got to me that he was pissed about Linden having made it to begin with. His reasoning is that it has hindered him from fixing things, stopped him from encasing Foul within time. He speaks as though he anticipated being able to do that before he died in WGW, but his actions in that book don't exactly intimate that he had any such prediction in his mind...

But what annoyed me even more than this huge discrepancy was the fact that Linden was buying it! She should damn well know better than that! It's not that easy. She had been so much in need of TC that she seemed to be buying everything he said, or at least enough to allow herself to question her convictions on the most positive thing she had done for the Land -- make the Staff of Law and begin the healing of the Land from the Sunbane -- an act that was clearly prompted by TC.

But as I said before, though she was clearly buying this tripe, on a deeper level she was suspicious. SRD's constantly peppering the text at such times with echoed remembrances of what TC told her in her dreams, i.e. You need the Staff of Law, serve to give the impression that something is gurgling beneath the surface of Linden's consciousness (it was gurgling beneath mine, too) ...

[lurch]

yada,,,

anyway...there is an interesting comparison between Chap 2 and Chap 3,,both being question an answer sessions. Jay,, you were zeroing in on it but opted for the slapstick. Okay by me, so, allow me to take it along if you don't mind.

Compare the answers,,and how Linden reacts to the answers in Chap 2 and chap 3. Esmer gives her answers she is unable to make sense out of,,because as per Esmer, they are beyond her knowledge..then in chap 3..Convenant gives her answers that are within her ability to grasp and understand,, but also grasp the underlining falseness and implications of the falseness . So...Esmers answers bare truth but are beyond her,,and " Toms" answers are full of lies,,and she can't quite deal with that reality either..And she is left with following " Tom" because there is no one else offering a path to go foward.

Spoiler

But for me..the real " feel" of this chapter is in the " croyeled " son of hers. His " communication",, every look,, whimper.. side remark,, statement,,is meant to just add more weight to Lindens burden she is carrying. Every gesture and word from Jerry is meant to deepen the pain and anguish of Lindens and be especially heart breaking when the inevitable reveal moment comes. The Play on Linden by the Croyeled son of hers is almost gut wrenching. I can hear the sick joy of malice in every word he is given in this chapter.,,IMHO..Donaldson is pretty dark in this chapter...Sorry,,but perhaps thats why I could not find a lighter side approach to this chapter, here. So , Thanks Jay, for finding one.

[mod edit - references to events not covered thus far in dissection must be spoilered - thanks, dlb]

[wayfriend]

Thanks for starting us off, Jay.

Love and Strangers
Love and Strangers
Go together like
the Astros and the Rangers

Is this the song you were thinking of? Anyway ...

The first thing I have to wonder about is, why did Donaldson want us to hear what Esmer had to say before we heard what Covenant had to say? It seems rather odd.

Was it to warn us that "That which appears evil need not have been so from the beginning"? Covanant appears evil, perhaps. He's certainly not what he was in the beginning.

Or was it to convey that she "must be the first to drink of the Earthblood"? Certainly this comment means that someone else will be trying to drink the Earthblood, too. And that Esmer knows all about it.

The Mahdoubt is gone. Covenant and Jeremiah arrive, and the Mahdoubt splits.

Stave says, "It cannot lack meaning that such divergent events have occurred together."

I really like this.

"She will learn what she can," Mahrtiir said, "and do what she must. This the Ramen understand, who have spent their lives in the service of the Ranyhyn. But the Masters have lost such wisdom, for they conceive themselves equal to that which they serve."

We have talked before about the possible meaning of the redeeming qualities of inadequacy. And here it is, explained with the Ramen and the Haruchai.

I agree 100% with this assessment. The Haruchai do conceive that they are equal to what they serve. Not in a way that means that they are a match. But in a way that means that the Haruchai feel that they can judge that which they serve, and that they can make choices for that which they serve. Even that that which they serve is honored by their service.

The quality of the Ramen's service is indeed different than that of the Haruchai. And it is, I feel, superior. They've never had caused to doubt their service, because they've never expected their service to be perfect. They've never considered themselves the equal of the Ranyhyn in any way. The Haruchai are arrogant in a way, where the Ramen are not.

The result is that the Ramen keep on trying. Doubt does not disturb them. Despair does not dissuade them. Failure does not daunt them. Their eyes are not on the sky, but on where their feet meet the road.

Because they do not believe that they are anything other than inadequate, the persevere where the Haruchai do not.

And the Ramen see in Linden the same perseverance.

Chink?

Then Kastenessen would still be stuck in his Durance, and the skurj would still be trapped, and Kevin's Dirt wouldn't exist, and Foul wouldn't have been able to find that chink in Joan's mind, and we wouldn't have caesures and Demondim and ur-viles and Esmer and the bloody II!earth Stone to worry about.

It's interesting that there's a possible implication that Kastenessen, as he is behind the skurj escaping, might also be behind Kevin's Dirt and Foul's manipulation of Joan.

But anyway ... so sometime after the end of WGW, Foul found a "chink" in Joan's mind. One he presumably didn't know about before. I wonder what this means.

Covenant says "No, Linden, the manacles are for me." Do we have any reason to doubt this? I think not. We may have to accept this as the answer for the time being.

So much could have been averted, if anyone had recognized Foul when they let him into Revelstone.

"Poor Kevin," Covenant sighed unkindly. "He didn't recognize Foul because no one in the Land knew who the Despiser was. ... Kevin actually let him join the Council, and still no one saw the truth.

Spoiler

This sentence is EXACTLY when I started to wonder.

When Covenant started into his rant about Berek doing "his 'beautitude and striving' thing", I really got to contrasting the old Covenant and this new Covenant.

Because Covenant used to rant much more effectively. Much more engagingly. Sure, he used to be disparaging of the old Lords and the stuff that they did. ("Do you know what happened to Kevin? You bloody Bloodguard did!") But it was poignant and moving. This ... this now is merely just blathering. Like it's pure disrespect, with nothing that resonates to Covenant's plight.

And then Covenant says

"And [Foul's] pretty damn good at getting what he wants by misdirection. He always acts like he's after something completely different."

If this is true -- and can we doubt it is? -- don't we have to re-evaluate everything that we think Foul is after?

About the skurj, Covenant says ""You'll recognize them when you see them. Foul showed you what they're like."

How does he know?!?!

----------------------------------------

One more overall comment.

Linden doesn't give Covenant his (her) ring.

If Linden ever had a chance to be reckless, it was then.

If she ever had a chance to do *anything* to get her son back, it was at that moment.

If she ever had wished for Covenant to take the mantle of responsibility off her shoulders, her wish could have been granted.

Inadequate. Confused. Crushed by loss.

But she does not yield her ring.

There should be nothing less than thunderous applause here.

[earthbrah]

Nice post, Wayfriend. And not to remain fixated on my point, but the fact that Linden does not cede the ring to TC is evidence that she is not convinced of him. It's the one tangible expression of her suspicion. The ground she found to stand on between her memories of him and the man before her was solid enough to let her keep that much sense, at least. Dangerous ground, but solid.

[kevinswatch]

Because Covenant used to rant much more effectively. Much more engagingly. Sure, he used to be disparaging of the old Lords and the stuff that they did. ("Do you know what happened to Kevin? You bloody Bloodguard did!") But it was poignant and moving. This ... this now is merely just blathering. Like it's pure disrespect, with nothing that resonates to Covenant's plight.

Well, he is drunk.-jay

[lurch]

Well, he is drunk.-jay

yea,,,thats one of many contrasts between chap 2 and chap 3. Chap 2 has Linden "cleansed" from the Glimmermere experience,,Chap3 has " Tom" besooted in booze..Cold lake, heated quarters from th fire in the hearth. etc etc, on and on the contrasting differences between chapters..She doesn't get what truth Esmer tells her,, but she does get what lies Tom is telling her and doesn't want to deal with the obvious falseness of it all..She did ask him about the scar on his forehead,,like it was a trap,, and he basically stepped in it,,But there she was still making up possibilities to explain his " contraryness". She got answers ..but couldn't come to terms with them.

[drew]

By the way, I'm sure this has been discussed before in multiple topics elsewhere, but what's the deal with Linden always referring to Thomas Covenant as "Covenant"? She calls the man that she loves by the last name? That's a bit too X-filesy.

Linden has always called TC "Covenant." I can't think of an instance where she calls him "Tom" or "Thomas." In fact, now that I think about it, the only person who ever called him "Tom" was Joan.

I think the fact that she calls him, and reffers to him as Covenant, is good foreshadowing...I know we're not supposed to discuss further chapters in the disscussion, but it's HERE in THIS chapter, when we get our first hints (however obscure they might be) as to the identinty of oc Covenant and Jerry.

[Zarathustra]

This chapter is going to take some time. It's one of the most important chapters In Fatal Revenant.

Donalson does a wonderful job at meeting our expectations, and then fucking with them. Walking a tightrope of reveal-and-conceal (much like Esmer and Cov, see below). From the start of this book, we all know that something isn't right with Covenant coming back. We don’t know at this point how much is author misdirection, or how much we should take literally (as Jay points out). The problem of Covenant’s return is nearly identical for us, the readers, as it is for Linden--allowing all the misdirection to work on two levels. We miss Covenant, want him back, want to believe that everything is okay; just like Linden. But it’s obviously not okay. Our own expectations is a kind of "glamour," too. [1. An air of compelling charm, romance, and excitement, especially when delusively alluring. 2. Archaic. A magic spell; enchantment.]

I really like the tightrope SRD was walking here. His portrayal of Covenant did exactly what it was supposed to do: arouse our suspicions, but put us in the same boat as Linden. We “know” something is wrong. But we can’t ignore the possiblity that this is indeed Covenant after his time in the Arch.

Yet . . . “How did his place in the Arch of Time enable him to violate time’s most fundamental strictures?” p.40

Even before we get to drunk Cov--and all the personality discrepancies--we get this metaphysical, conceptual discrepancy on page one of this chapter. His presence violates the deepest structures of this Land. Yet, the explanation seems relatively plausible. Donaldson walking the tightrope . . .

And this conceptual discrepancy is connected directly to Cov’s character: “Millennia ago, Covenant had promised that he would never use power again. But he was using power now: he was folding time.” P49

So not only is his behavior violating the deepest structure of this Land, but it is also violating his deepest conviction, the lesson he learned at the end of WGW. [At this point, it might be a good time to remember a passage from chapter 2: "But now she thought that perhaps his words three and a half thousand years ago explained his unexpected appearance here. He had been transformed in death: Lord Foul had burned away the venom, leaving Covenant's spirit purified. As a result, he may have become a kind of perfect being-who could wield wild magic and fear nothing.” P20]

Stave describes the tightrope just about as good as anyone:

“I mislike this confluence. Plainly the return of the Unbeliever from the Arch of Time holds great import. It appears to promise that the Land’s redemption is at hand. Yet his account of his coming troubles me. That he is able to cast a glamour of confusion upon the Demondim, I do not greatly question. However, his avowal concerning distorition of the Law of Time—“ He hesitated momentarily, then said, “And Esmer’s grandsire connives with Demondim while Esmer himself removes Waynhim and urviles from their proper time.

Stave hesitates on precisely that issue which should be the biggest red flag for us: distortion of the Law of Time. And curiously, he uses the same word the Mahdoubt uses: “glamour.” We’re getting warnings all over the place.

And it can’t be coincidence that all this is happening now, together. One point Stave stresses is the of “coincidence” of Kasty conniving with Demondim, while his grandsire removes Waynhim and urviles from their proper time. First, we’ve got the thematic union of hereditary connections between Esmer and Kasty, as well as the Waynhim, urviles, Demondim, (and Viles). But there is also a connection between Covenant distoring time, and Esmer taking these beings out of their proper time. Next he says:

“Chosen, here is cause for concern. It cannot lack meaning that such divergent events have occurred together.”

So he’s troubled by all this interconnection. Which means that Donaldson wants us to see trouble in all these connections. Donaldson wants us to see the linkage, and to realize that the danger lies in this linkage.

Lurch, nice comparison between 2 and 3. There is another one early on, first page of this chapter: . . . Thomas Covenant and Jeremiah had refused to let her touch them; and Esmer had foiled her efforts to find out what was wrong with them.” Both Esmer and Covenant are apparently hiding the truth, misdirecting Linden, and giving her pieces of truth at the same time. After her encounter with both of them, the central problem of remains unresolved: “Her fear that they had been herded toward her remained unresolved.” And this herding point is important because it determines if Covenant was here due to her enemies’ wishes, or to TC’s wishes.

Do we know that Tom’s answers are lies? They seem to be misdirection more than lies, just like Esmer’s answers. In fact, both Esmer and Covenant talk about issues of the past which apparently have no relevance to the topic at hand. Esmer with the Viles, Covenant with the Berek/Kevin rant. It seemed to me (especially with the advantage of hindsight) that Covenant was trying to tell Linden something, give her a lesson of despair, while at the same time trying to distract her from Jeremiah’s answers. Similarly, Esmer was telling her something that (again, with hindsight) has relevance to what she’s about to do, while simultaneously “distracting her” or at least misdirecting her, so that this aid betrays at the same time.

It’s interesting that Cov is giving her a lesson about Kevin’s despair. We get a new twist on the Ritual of Desecration: Kevin despaired because he sacrificed those he loved! Cov is making a threat, implicit here and explicit later in the chapter, that she must do what he wants because she doesn’t want that kind of despair on her hands. It's almost like he’s holding Jeremiah hostage, trying to get the ransom of the ring.

“By the time Kevin became High Lord,, he was already doomed.” p. 58. Kevin apparently “inherited a real talent for doubt from his father.” And this inheritance is directly related to Viles and Demondim undermining Loric’s confidence. (THAT’S a story I’d like to hear!) This passage reminds me of Stave’s fear that all this is connected. Viles and Demondim undermining confidence in the past. . . and here we have the possibility of the Demondim “herding” T and J as Linden’s first cause (back in chapter 1) to think something is wrong with T and J, even before they arrive. Undermining her confidence.

Spoiler

And later we have the Viles again.

Cov is preparing her for despair.

Lurch, might want to spoiler tag that last paragraph!!

Wayfriend, fantastic point about Linden not giving up the ring. I am applauding her.

[kevinswatch]

It's one of the most important chapters In Fatal Revenant.

Then why the heck did you guys give it to me to start??? Heh.-jay

[danlo]

coda:

You take a mortal man,
And put him in control
Watch him become a god
Watch peoples heads a'roll
A'roll...

chorus:
Just like the Pied Piper
Led rats through the streets
We dance like marionettes
Swaying to the Symphony ...
Of Destruction

Acting like a robot
Its metal brain corrodes
You try to take its pulse
Before the head explodes
Explodes...

[Chorus]
[Solo]

The earth starts to rumble
World powers fall
A'warring for the heavens
A peaceful man stands tall
Tall...

[lurch]

The issue of Linden perceiving the bull crap from this Tom can be taken a bit further. Yes, his answers are half truths and distortions most in a purely negative sense, meant more than to teach but drive Linden to Despair. And Little Jerry is there making sure Linden is held within the parameters of this corralling and doesn't jump fence. And at the end of the q&a session, its like , Linden acquiesces to the situation with the simple notion of nobody else is moving forward, so she'll go along with it all , with the hope somehow she will get closer to whoever has her son and wherever he is.

This is a very interesting "situation". You are confronted with a Lie. Your wife is cheating on you. Your business partner is pilfering the cash register. Your councilman wants some under the table money in order to get what needs to be done, done,,,you national leader makes up a story that justifies a War. In any case, the fundamental moral and or ethical " break" ,,collapse,,negation, is or becomes obvious.What does one do?

Linden holds back, she stifles her outrage for the sake of freeing her Jerry. Fascinating surrender to the " hostage" condition she is in. At what point do we start " compromising" what we know to be right in order to reach our intended end? The " game" is established and she goes along with it, in the name of Love for Jerry. You can do something,,have a plan of action,,in the " name " of high values,,abstractions,,godly concepts,,but if you do not understand,,know,,have ingrained,,these higher values,,abstractions..then what can you do but follow along due to no other forward choices.?

So, there is a sense by the end of chapter,,of no other choice. This self depreciating,, self defeatism,,runs its course thru out the rest of the the first section and IS The Illusion Linden must rise above. Other choices are always waiting to be discovered, once we know where they can be found.

[Fist and Faith]

Linden has always called TC "Covenant." I can't think of an instance where she calls him "Tom" or "Thomas." In fact, now that I think about it, the only person who ever called him "Tom" was Joan.

Yeah, I know that, but it's still a little strange. I mean, I know there are people out there who refer to other people by their last name, and people who prefer their last name, but using that name for your lover?

If I hadn't seen it work so well for Maggie and Joel on Northern Exposure, I'd have said it's stupid and couldn't possibly happen.