The Bonehunters [Spoilers]

[Onos T'oolan]

Having finished my second reading of HoC a few weeks ago, before reading MT, I'm in good shape for this reading.

So far, it's kinda fantastic!

Where the hell is Jenn... heh

[Farm Ur-Ted]

Hair gel? I don't need no stinkin' hair gel! I got a life-time supply of snot, thank-you-very-much!

[aliantha]

Ew, yeah. That guy is really gross. And he doesn't get any nicer on further acquaintance, either.

[Farm Ur-Ted]

I'm into the second book now. Holy crap, this first chapter of book 2 is 80 pages long. It's pretty gripping.

Oh, yeah, and I'm stoked that Paran is back!

[Onos T'oolan]

Yeah, I was suprised when Paran showed up. For some reason, I expected it to turn out to be an imposter.

My favorite parts so far are the scant few about Dejim Nebrahl. Not only because it, and T'rolbarahl in general, are wicked cool, but because I love any info about Dessimbelackis. I didn't realize he created the Dark Hounds. I figured they were a natural part of Darkness, and that the Hounds of Shadow were the same for Shadow. One azalan demon wiped out over five hundred guys in 50 heartbeats, then two Dark Hounds took out five azalan demons with ease. Onrack was powerless before them. Dessimbelackis sure did a serious bit of work when he made them! (I'm assuming he became D'ivers, and is them. All leading up to the Beast Ritual that the T'lan Imass responded to by slaughtering the human First Empire.)

(I guess Karsa is about the toughest thing around. Difficult to measure his upper limits. Karsa killed the two Dark Hounds. Not to mention punching Icarium unconscious. Frankly, I don't like that Karsa is so powerful. But he sure makes for a lot of fun!! )

So now the sappers just went to breach the walls, and one of those damned Mott Irregulars screwed around. I'll continue this evening to see how that turns out! Good to see L'oric again.

And yeah, your sig stood out in my mind too!

[Farm Ur-Ted]

And yeah, your sig stood out in my mind too!

I read that line maybe 4 times before I remembered that Roach was a dog; I at first thought that it was the kid, Grub (or whatever he's called), and I just thought it was one of the sickest things I'd ever read. Either way, it totally cracks me up. I don't know where Erikson comes up with stuff like that.

[I'm Murrin]

My favorite parts so far are the scant few about Dejim Nebrahl. Not only because it, and T'rolbarahl in general, are wicked cool, but because I love any info about Dessimbelackis. I didn't realize he created the Dark Hounds. I figured they were a natural part of Darkness, and that the Hounds of Shadow were the same for Shadow. One azalan demon wiped out over five hundred guys in 50 heartbeats, then two Dark Hounds took out five azalan demons with ease. Onrack was powerless before them. Dessimbelackis sure did a serious bit of work when he made them! (I'm assuming he became D'ivers, and is them. All leading up to the Beast Ritual that the T'lan Imass responded to by slaughtering the human First Empire.)

You're forgetting that in HoC we saw that the Deragoth are a heck of a lot older not only than the First Empire, but than the whole human race. Dessimbelackis didn't make them.
And they're not really Hounds of Darkness, either. Osserc pointed that out to Loric when he explained them, and mentioned the name.

[Onos T'oolan]

I'm not forgetting, I'm just very confused. And let me take one little step at a time. Heh.

HoC:

Osric halted and faced his son once more. "The Hounds of Darkness. The seven beasts that Dessimbelackis made pact with...

BH:

T'rolbarahl, demonic creations by the hand of Dessimbelackis himself, long before the Dark Hounds took shape in the Emperor's mind.

So what are you saying?
1) The Hounds of Darkness are not the Dark Hounds?
or
2) "Took shape" does not mean he came up with the idea of them, then made them?

[I'm Murrin]

I'm saying that the Deragoth had something to do with Dessimbelackis, but at the minute Erikson, Esselmont, and maybe a few others are the only people who know what that was.

To be slightly more useful, I get the impression that not many people (within the story) were really aware of what the relationship was between Dessimbelackis and the hounds, where they came from, &c.

And, well, it's possible that Dessimbelackis did create something different, only using the Deragoth, but we don't know for certain what happened, and can only wait to find out. There's the connection between them and the Hounds of Shadow to be explained, too.

[Onos T'oolan]

OK, fair enough. But the Deragoth and the Hounds of Darkness are the same things, right? That's what I got from L'oric and Osric talking.

But didn't the Deragoth enter the Raraku memory that Osric was living in? They weren't memories of the Deragoth, were they? And if they weren't memories, how can there have been seven of them there if two were imprisoned in the statues that Onrack freed?

[I'm Murrin]

The Deragoth Loric and Osserc saw were the Deragoth of the past, yes. Osserc explains that it was they who kept the K'Chain Chemalle from ever establishing a presence on that continent.

[Onos T'oolan]

Right. But still, how can all seven of them be in that memory if two are trapped in the statues for Onrack to free?

(And, again, I think Karsa is too powerful. The seven Deragoth kept the K'Chain Che'Malle race off the continent? Yeah, the seven can take the three K'ell Hunters we saw, but an army of K'Chain Che'Malle?? Anybody physically powerful enough to kill two of these Hounds... OK, I imagine we'll see him doing some huge stuff, and maybe you've already seen it. Heh. But the Toblakai should be ruling the world.)

[I'm Murrin]

Right. But still, how can all seven of them be in that memory if two are trapped in the statues for Onrack to free?

Remember, that was a very, very long time ago.

[Onos T'oolan]

I got the impression that the memory was from long ago, but that it was a reality of its own now, continuing on. That Osric lives there now, in the present. Heck. L'oric asked what warren it was. And I thought that, like Osric, the Hounds went there, and were real (not just part of the memory), and are also in the present. No? (Heh)

[Farm Ur-Ted]

(I guess Karsa is about the toughest thing around. Difficult to measure his upper limits. Karsa killed the two Dark Hounds. Not to mention punching Icarium unconscious. Frankly, I don't like that Karsa is so powerful. But he sure makes for a lot of fun!! )

Well, there are a lot of things in the books that are a bit too strong. The freaking Moranth munitions seem to have no limits to what they can blow up (gotten to that section yet?).

[Onos T'oolan]

I haven't been able to read five pages in the last two days. I've only seen the one explosion, when the Mott Irregular (can't remember his name) used too many, and almost blew them all up. And Fiddler took down a building a few minutes later.

[Farm Ur-Ted]

That's the one.

Pust; damn, that guy's funny.

[Farm Ur-Ted]

I finished book 2 last night. I'll put this in spoilers for Tool (don't read it, Tool-man!). (Edit: Removed spoiler tags.)

Wow, I've got to say I didn't see the ending coming at all. When Scillara was first attacked, I thought it was a dream sequence. But once we got the other death POV's, I realized that it was really happening. I don't think that Iscarul Pust and Mogora are going to show up in time to stitch Cutter's guts back in. Bummer. I did notice that Erikson got a little bit sneaky. We don't know what happened to Felisin Younger, but I think it's safe to assume she's still alive. Still, it was pretty weird to have that group killed off. I'm not quite sure what the point of it was, but I'm sure it will make sense before the book's over.

I liked the way the scene started, though, with Heboric saying "We are the Fallen." I thought that was weird at first. On the previous page, Hedge had noted that he was one of the Fallen, and when I read that it occurred to me that that may have been the first time in the series that the term had been used in the text (although it's been used in the chapter headings I'm pretty sure). So when Heboric said it, I was thinking, dude, you're not dead yet. Oops. I guess he saw it coming.

[Onos T'oolan]

Well, back to work today after the holiday weekend, so I whould be able to get some serious reading done again. But I did manage to finish book 2 last night, so I read your spoiler.



Nothing but spoilers below, folks.



I never saw it coming!! Holy crap!!! However, I assume that's not the end of their story. A god could heal them. And they certainly wouldn't be the first to play a role from beyond the dead. I imagine you, Ted, have read more by now and already know the answer. Of course, Murrin and ali have.

OK, some more info on the Deragoth. Heh. Very interesting! They are, indeed, much older than Dessimbelackis. So

T'rolbarahl, demonic creations by the hand of Dessimbelackis himself, long before the Dark Hounds took shape in the Emperor's mind.

means

T'rolbarahl, demonic creations by the hand of Dessimbelackis himself, long before the idea of using the Dark Hounds took shape in the Emperor's mind.

So now I wonder if the Hounds of Shadow always numbered seven because they are reflections of the seven Deragoth Dessimbelackis merged with, or if, like the Deragoth, there were once (possibly still?) more than seven Hounds of Shadow.


Interesting development with Icarium and Mappo! Wow! Can't wait to see how all that works out!


Bottle continues to be very cool, as he was in HoC. The best was when he fell through the spiders' webs, then went into them so they wouldn't bite him, and found all that rage. Great scene.


And holy... Here's the best death scene I remember ever reading:

A sharp crack, shaking dust from the wall behind Pella, grit raining down onto the back of his neck, then screams. Another concussion - ducking still lower, Pella looked back up at the opposite window-

To see, momentarily, a single flash-

-to feel the shock of surprise-

-as the arrow sped at him. A hard, splintering cracking sound. Pella's head was thrown back, helm crunching against the wall. Something, wavering, at the upper edge of his vision, but those edges were growing darker. He heard his crossbow clatter to the cobbles at his feet, then distant pain as his knees struck the stones, the jolt peeling skin away - he'd done that once, as a child, playing in the alley. Stumbling, knees skidding on gritty, filthy cobbles-

So filthy, the murk of hidden diseases, infections - his mother had been so angry, angry and frightened. They'd had to go to a healer, and that had cost money - money they had been saving for a move. To a better part of the slum. The dream...put away, all becase he'd skinned his knees.

Just like now. And darkness closing in.

Oh Momma, I skinned my knees. I'm sorry. I'm so sorry. I skinned my knees...

[Farm Ur-Ted]

I never saw it coming!! Holy crap!!! However, I assume that's not the end of their story. A god could heal them. And they certainly wouldn't be the first to play a role from beyond the dead. I imagine you, Ted, have read more by now and already know the answer. Of course, Murrin and ali have.

Yeah, Erikson gives a resolution pretty quickly in book 3. Not a big surprise, for the most part, I'll say. I'm still shocked that the mission to the jade statue on Otatarol island was pretty well squashed, though (well, I think so).

I'm just starting book 4. Can't wait to see how things end. I'll probably start Reaper's Gale sometime in august, and may just read ToH right when it comes out. I almost never new releases, but I may have to do it this time. Then, I may (*gasp*) actually start doing a re-read of some of the books, at least the first 2.