An Inconsistency in the Chronicles

[wayfriend]

I find it hard to believe that the Theomach is gone from the story, too. Or, rather, the Guardian. I believe we'll see the Guardian again. Donaldson would not have added that bit about the original Guardian being an Elohim, replaced by the Theomach, unless the consequences of this are important in some way.

And as for the New Staff becoming the Old Staff... the biggest reason to doubt this is that there is no reason. Why does that need to happen? How does it serve the story?

[inablackout]

Well, earlier Roger was talking about trapping foul in a bubble of time, couldn't the staff be used in some way to make that happen? So Foul essentially gets stuck from say Bereks time to when ever the loop is created, keeping him from causeing more trouble?

Also one other thing that crossed my mind, Being as Linden is actually dead in her world, or so we are lead to believe, in her mind what does she care wether the land or earth are destroyed by her actions? Whats her motivation aside from "saveing her son"? Also Foul has Joan, which as i see it, gives him a pressure release valve if Linden gets too close to defeating him, all he has to do is kill Joan and poof Linden, Roger and Jerimiah are gone.

Is it possible that the Masters had something to do with the creation of Kevins Dirt? After all they are the ones who don't want the inhabitants of the land to know about earth power.

As stated theres so many directions the story line can take. Waiting for the next book is gonna kill me!!! LOL

[inablackout]

When is Anele's impact on the story line going to start, he's just been floating around. Hasn't really had much to do with anything other than trying to find the staff of law. Hiding in his madness cause he can't handle reality.

[Demondime-a-dozen-spawn]

I apparently overlooked it while reading, but Esmer/the Elohim are (for whatever reason) responsible for Kevin's Dirt.

But you're right - The Masters are directly benefited by it.

When is Anele's impact on the story line going to start, he's just been floating around. Hasn't really had much to do with anything other than trying to find the staff of law. Hiding in his madness cause he can't handle reality.

I predict that in book 4, Linden is going to fuse Anele and Esmer into yet a third Staff of Law, so the land will henceforth have a spare in case of damage or loss.

[inablackout]

Ok is it possible that the Masters asked them to do it?

[wayfriend]

I apparently overlooked it while reading, but Esmer/the Elohim are (for whatever reason) responsible for Kevin's Dirt.

It was actually Esmer and Kastenessen, at the urging of Foul, via a Raver.

[Demondime-a-dozen-spawn]

I sure hope I don't completely miss such an important revelation my second time through.

[Orlion]

Also Foul has Joan, which as i see it, gives him a pressure release valve if Linden gets too close to defeating him, all he has to do is kill Joan and poof Linden, Roger and Jerimiah are gone.

You forget, Hile Troy did not go "poof" when Atairan was consumed as a result of summoning him. In fact, it could be that being dead in the "real" world enables those summoned to the Land to remain even if their summoners are dead.

As stated theres so many directions the story line can take. Waiting for the next book is gonna kill me!!! LOL

Seconded

[wayfriend]

I apparently overlooked it while reading, but Esmer/the Elohim are (for whatever reason) responsible for Kevin's Dirt.

It was actually Esmer and Kastenessen, at the urging of Foul, via a Raver.

Believe it or not, I didn't catch this my first time through, either. There was actually a lot of stuff I didn't catch my first time through.

The second time I read it I was participating in the book dissections. So I read each chapter AND took notes. Because I made such an effort to note details, I found a lot of details I missed.

I think when we first read such a book there is so much eagerness to see where everything is going, to see what happens, that we're not devoted to retaining details.

Especially the way Donaldson reveals details. Usually in the middle of some sort of battle.

So anyway ... this is my attempt at saying, don't sweat it so much.

[Demondime-a-dozen-spawn]

Will do, wayfriend! (Not sweat it so much.)

I'll be rereading FR as soon as I'm done reading the three ( ! ) books I'm reading now.

[Ur Dead]

Two cents worth:

I have always said that Linden's made staff is not the one weilded by the Old-new Lords.

The staff itself can be.. both, because there would be a beginning for it and an end. (WGW where it was created and TPTP where it was destroyed)
But what of the metal pieces that were on the ends of the Staff?
When the 1st staff was blasted by the wild magic, the wood vaporized but the metal heels survived. Bannor took them back to Revelstone where Vain 3500 years later placed one on his wrist and the other on an ankle.
These metal ends would be the key factor why Linden will not give her staff to Berek. How bonded are they to Linden's staff and what is needed to remove them? The metals end would have to be removed before Linden can give Berek the staff. (why should she or Berek remove them?)What would happen to the staff if these were removed? They were on Vain(darn near bonded to him) at the time Linden fused Findail and Vain together. These metal ends or the material they were made from would never have a beginning nor an end.
This is the mobius effect relating to the staff. It's not the staff itself that causes paradox, it the metal caps that would cause it. The point of paradox would be at the time TC destoyed Elena's Staff. The metal ends would have had to be vaporized also, for Linden's Staff to be given to Berek. We know that it didn't happen.
Plus that burb that Wayfriend mentioned. The one tree looked like a portion was cut from it but I'll agree that that could be worked around.

I havn't found a decription of the first staff except that it was a long wooded staff shod with metal and was intricately carved from end to end.
The second staff as it stands is a long very black staff with a set of carving. The Forestal said the blackness was lamateable but he wouldn't change it. So it leads me to believe that some more carving or runes will be written

As far as the runes? Those were Specialized Tools that allowed each staff to manipulate Earthpower to preform a certain task not normally available to a person (mortal).
We don't know what was on the 1st staff and know what the runes on the second staff manipulated. We know that only twow characters were transposed from the afterlife back to a mortal life, Hollian and Thomas.
One took the essence of a Forestal to preform and the other took a motal with a instrument to do. (which leads you to on how powerful a Forestal really was)

When Linden created the second staff, the material(Vain and Findail) and power used (Wild Magic) probably resulted in a staff that was more powerful than the first, tho Berek's staff was created from a portion of the worm. Each had it own strengths and Berek's were carved with symbols
that allowed it to do lore that it normally wouldn't be possible. The lore employed by the Old and maybe some of the new Lords maybe have imprinted Earthpower for the feats to be repeated. When Linden created the second one, these "lores" may have been embedded onto the new staff and the need for runes to allow these lore were not needed.
Maybe the residue of the 1st staff runes resides in the metal end of Linden's staff. Who knows.
The Laws of Life and Death were not broken by the 1st Staff of Law.
(and why is it call the Law of Life and Death? These are portions of the same overall Law, but that is another discussion)
It was the Power of Command and Caer Caveral that broke the barriers, so that the second staff needs runes to breach and manipulate those damaged laws. These laws are damaged but have not been destroyed.
The Staff existance may be reforcing the barriers that made up the laws.

It may be that the Staff of Law that holds others from doing what Linden did. It was the runes on the second staff that allows it's own ditates to be circumvented when weilded by the holder.
But maybe a powerful being can overpower what the Staff can try to protect/prevent.(Foul, Ravers with power from the Illearth Stne, etc, etc) The dead can breach the barrier but may not be able to act on it own. It may prevent mortals and lesser being to act like Elena did.

Right now I don't see an Inconsistency with the Chronicles.

[inablackout]

ok well looks like you did some research on the subject of the staff.

How bout this. We don't have enough info on the first staff or when it was truly made. Could it be possible that somehow the blackness of Lindens Staff is changed (for reasons we have yet to read), SRD keeps talking about her heart and the blackness, if somehow she see's the light and her staff is brought back to its original color, also theres not enough info from the first staff to say wether or not the runes or "symbols" are the same or not as LA's Staff.

Also it seems to me, that those metal ends are of more import than we are being led to believe. Yes they were on the originl staff, and yes Vain "fused" them to himself. That says to me they could be important in the next 2 books being as SRD keeps refering to them vaguely.

As i stated in another post the piece of the one tree"worm" could have been removed for another purpose yet to be revealed, maybe to seal kastanessan back into his service of holding back the skurj? Possibly LA will fuse that piece into the current staff changing it into what we know as the original staff?

I'm just throwing out what ifs here...it just bugs me we have to wait another 17 months til the next book is released.....damn it!!!

[jacob Raver, sinTempter]

I was confused by this at first, but then I became convinced that the comment about the Staff not needing runes was one of Linden's perception and not one from the omnisicent narrator (similar to the comment in ROTE that "Because the ur-viles had betrayed Lord Foul, he had destroyed them all.")

I always thought that an author has to be very, very careful with the 'viewpoint' issue which SRD so loves...if you can't trust the protagonist in a story that only follows that one person, it really can...I'm not sure what I'm trying to say here...know what I mean?

[Wheelwash Whitecap]

I don't understand how CW knew that LA SOL needed Runes? What...Can he see into the future?

At the time he did this, the original SOL did not exist yet, as far as I know. It was made at a later time.

What does the statement CW makes signify, upon looking at LA SOL? "This blackness is lamentable, but I will not alter it. Its import lies beyond my ken."