That is all.
Breaking Bad
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Zarathustra
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wayfriend
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I thought the sting in last night's episode was pretty sweet.
However, I was disappointed to see Walter give up. I kept saying, he's-got-a-plan, he's-got-a-plan ... he didn't have a plan. I guess that's a turning point for his character... but it's not one I enjoyed seeing. The Walter I know always finds a way out, because he never believes that there is no way out.
However, I was disappointed to see Walter give up. I kept saying, he's-got-a-plan, he's-got-a-plan ... he didn't have a plan. I guess that's a turning point for his character... but it's not one I enjoyed seeing. The Walter I know always finds a way out, because he never believes that there is no way out.
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Jesse knew exactly where to hit him - his money. He sent him that picture of the barrel of money and started taunting him about setting it on fire and Walt just lost all composure. He didn't have time to scheme; he just had to react.
I didn't necessarily see it as a failing on Walt's part - he just got outplayed by Jesse.
However, that being said... he's not done yet. In the midst of this shootout, he does have a gun over by the rocks where he dropped it. That might come into play. I'm pretty sure Hank and Gomez are goners. In fact, it looks like Gomie was already hit as they were ducking for cover behind the car Walt is in (hard to tell, but it looked like blood on him).
Jesse could conceivably get away, but the NeoNazis have seen him in the car and they know he is there somewhere (it was him they were coming to kill after all) so they will be looking for him.
My theory is that Todd gets killed, Walt manages to slip away (somehow - I have no idea how) and the Nazis capture Jesse to use as their new cook.
Next week is supposed to be the "crap your pants" episode (as Jesse put it) so who knows what will happen.
I just know I'm loving it!
I didn't necessarily see it as a failing on Walt's part - he just got outplayed by Jesse.
However, that being said... he's not done yet. In the midst of this shootout, he does have a gun over by the rocks where he dropped it. That might come into play. I'm pretty sure Hank and Gomez are goners. In fact, it looks like Gomie was already hit as they were ducking for cover behind the car Walt is in (hard to tell, but it looked like blood on him).
Jesse could conceivably get away, but the NeoNazis have seen him in the car and they know he is there somewhere (it was him they were coming to kill after all) so they will be looking for him.
My theory is that Todd gets killed, Walt manages to slip away (somehow - I have no idea how) and the Nazis capture Jesse to use as their new cook.
Next week is supposed to be the "crap your pants" episode (as Jesse put it) so who knows what will happen.
I just know I'm loving it!
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Zarathustra
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Walt's "fault" has always been the conflict between his good side and his bad side. This is the crux of the entire series. That conflict either makes him not fully commit to doing the "right" thing for a drug kingpin, or makes him do the wrong thing ... like becoming a drug kingpin. You can't run a nice Evil Empire.
This conflict has arisen in many ways--in fact, it's the entire plot of every season, nearly every episode. Every "mistake" Walter has made has been one of these two forms (not fully committing to Breaking Bad, or taking this path to begin with and committing unspeakable crimes). And Jessie was there from the very beginning, his partner in crime, but also his student prior to that turn. As such, Jessie has always been central to Walt's personal dilemma, his conflict between good and evil. While Jessie enabled Walt's rise to power, he has also always represented the one person within the criminal world whom Walt would never sacrifice. His feelings and loyalty toward Jessie has been his biggest mistake as a drug kingpin, and his willingness to use/abuse Jessie has been his biggest mistake as a person trying to be true to his friends/family.
Therefore, it's utterly apt for Jessie to be instrumental in Walt's downfall ... which is really just the meeting of these two opposite poles. It's not that Jessie outsmarted Walt, or that Walt failed to have the perfect plan (which is impossible), it's that Jessie finally exposed this self-destructive dichotomy in a decisive, catastrophic way. And more importantly, he exposed it in a narratively perfect, true to the chracters, dramatic way.
Just beautiful story-telling. This is the greatest TV drama of all time.
This conflict has arisen in many ways--in fact, it's the entire plot of every season, nearly every episode. Every "mistake" Walter has made has been one of these two forms (not fully committing to Breaking Bad, or taking this path to begin with and committing unspeakable crimes). And Jessie was there from the very beginning, his partner in crime, but also his student prior to that turn. As such, Jessie has always been central to Walt's personal dilemma, his conflict between good and evil. While Jessie enabled Walt's rise to power, he has also always represented the one person within the criminal world whom Walt would never sacrifice. His feelings and loyalty toward Jessie has been his biggest mistake as a drug kingpin, and his willingness to use/abuse Jessie has been his biggest mistake as a person trying to be true to his friends/family.
Therefore, it's utterly apt for Jessie to be instrumental in Walt's downfall ... which is really just the meeting of these two opposite poles. It's not that Jessie outsmarted Walt, or that Walt failed to have the perfect plan (which is impossible), it's that Jessie finally exposed this self-destructive dichotomy in a decisive, catastrophic way. And more importantly, he exposed it in a narratively perfect, true to the chracters, dramatic way.
Just beautiful story-telling. This is the greatest TV drama of all time.
Success will be my revenge -- DJT
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I'm Murrin
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There was a moment when he was hiding behind the rocks, and he closed his eyes and steeled himself, then it cut to black (ad break?), before he walked out. I assumed at first - and kinda hoped - that he'd called back and told them to go through with it anyway, but his reaction when they arrive proved otherwise. Not sure what he was hoping for if they had backed off or not came at all.
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wayfriend
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That's what I am saying ... it seemed pretty much like he shrugged and said "oh, darn, they got me". It would have occurred to him that he was consigning his wife as well as himself to serious jail time, leaving his kids to fend, by giving up. It just didn't seem Walter to me.I'm Murrin wrote:Not sure what he was hoping for if they had backed off or not came at all.
Jesse, on the other hand, is kickin' bitches. I'm cheering for him at the same time.
Hank ... I never got on board that Hank would go from zero to pure despite for Walter so fast. I know there's not much time left, so I guess it is what it has to be. But it leaves me not really wanting him to win very much.
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wayfriend
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That's what I am saying ... it seemed pretty much like he shrugged and said "oh, darn, they got me". It would have occurred to him that he was consigning his wife as well as himself to serious jail time, leaving his kids to fend, by giving up. It just didn't seem Walter to me.I'm Murrin wrote:Not sure what he was hoping for if they had backed off or not came at all.
Jesse, on the other hand, is kickin' bitches. I'm cheering for him at the same time.
Hank ... I never got on board that Hank would go from zero to pure despite for Walter so fast. I know there's not much time left, so I guess it is what it has to be. But it leaves me not really wanting him to win very much.
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drew
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My theory is that Walt gets out of the car, and stands in the middle of the line of fire.
Hank doesn't want him dead, he wants him arrested (And somewhere SOMEWHERE inside of him, he still thinks of him as a brother). Todd's Uncle doesn't want him dead, he wants him to cook. So the gunfight will end.
That's as far as my theory goes. I don't know how that will translate into him moving out East and spending nearly a year there.
Hank doesn't want him dead, he wants him arrested (And somewhere SOMEWHERE inside of him, he still thinks of him as a brother). Todd's Uncle doesn't want him dead, he wants him to cook. So the gunfight will end.
That's as far as my theory goes. I don't know how that will translate into him moving out East and spending nearly a year there.
I thought you were a ripe grape
a cabernet sauvignon
a bottle in the cellar
the kind you keep for a really long time
a cabernet sauvignon
a bottle in the cellar
the kind you keep for a really long time
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Zarathustra
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I was hoping Walt had another card up his sleeve (and that makes me feel slimey ... rooting for him), but he was intelligent enough--man enough--to know when he was caught. There was nothing left for him to do but run into the desert. I think his "coward" comment to Jessie underscores the difference. And we can see it in the fact that he complies to every order Hank gives, without question or argument, once he's caught. It's like a chess player conceding defeat once he sees checkmate in the next few moves. It's actually graceful to acknowledge it, and a sign of one's intelligence, not to flounder about for a solution which a true master can see isn't there. His surrender was pure Walt.
As for Hank's instant transformation from BBQ-ing bro-in-law to arch nemisis ... this leaves out the fact that Hank has been chasing Walt as long as Walt has been Heisenberg. The only thing sudden about it is the revelation of Heisenberg's identity. Once that happens, not only does Hank have the validation of knowing who his own arch nemesis is, but also the sense of betrayal and making him look like a fool. I think his sudden turn was entirely believable and characteristic ... especially considering it almost led to a nervous breakdown.
I think if you watch all the episodes back-to-back, this would be clearer. It's easy to forget the single-minded focus--heck, the obsession--Hank had for catching Heisenberg.
As for Hank's instant transformation from BBQ-ing bro-in-law to arch nemisis ... this leaves out the fact that Hank has been chasing Walt as long as Walt has been Heisenberg. The only thing sudden about it is the revelation of Heisenberg's identity. Once that happens, not only does Hank have the validation of knowing who his own arch nemesis is, but also the sense of betrayal and making him look like a fool. I think his sudden turn was entirely believable and characteristic ... especially considering it almost led to a nervous breakdown.
I think if you watch all the episodes back-to-back, this would be clearer. It's easy to forget the single-minded focus--heck, the obsession--Hank had for catching Heisenberg.
Success will be my revenge -- DJT
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I'm Murrin
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Just when you think the show has given its best...
This slow finale is brilliant, I'm loving it.
Also: New theory!
This slow finale is brilliant, I'm loving it.
Spoiler
Walt's phone call at the end was brilliant. Realising it's too late to save himself, and saving Skyler while implicating himself. Getting everyone else off the hook, taking all the blame on himself.
Spoiler
Next episode, while out in his new life, he somehow finds out that blue meth is still around. Knowing that, he realises they kept Jesse alive to cook, and that's why he bought a gun and went back to Albuquerque in the half-season openers - to finish things off.
My theory (kinda long):
Of course, I've been wrong so often that I don't even expect it to really come out like this.
Last night I kept thinking, "Oh, this will happen next... WRONG!" "Ok, then this will happen... Oops... no!" And that was just during the knife fight LOL
Spoiler
In the preview you hear Saul talking to Walt, indicating that Walt's family will be in danger from the Aryan's with him gone. But Walt has presumably vanished, so Saul must have some way of contacting him.
Here is my guess: Jesse kills Todd and then refuses to cook for the Aryans. They kill him. Needing a cook, they abduct Walt's family to force him to come back. Saul contacts him, or they beat it out of Saul to find out where he is so they can get word to him.
He comes back with the gun we saw in the flashforwards to try and save his family.
The Ricin I think will end up being for Lydia, but I'm not sure on that part.
Here is my guess: Jesse kills Todd and then refuses to cook for the Aryans. They kill him. Needing a cook, they abduct Walt's family to force him to come back. Saul contacts him, or they beat it out of Saul to find out where he is so they can get word to him.
He comes back with the gun we saw in the flashforwards to try and save his family.
The Ricin I think will end up being for Lydia, but I'm not sure on that part.
Last night I kept thinking, "Oh, this will happen next... WRONG!" "Ok, then this will happen... Oops... no!" And that was just during the knife fight LOL
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Zarathustra
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God, that was brutal. So painful to watch a family disintegrate right before your eyes. Walt's phone call was a nice touch. You could tell how much it pained him. Also, begging for Hank's life, and Hank's response about he was too stupid to realize ...
Walt had dug those graves and didn't even know it. Kind of symbolic of his entire meth career, isn't it?
Jessie being forced to cook again is probably the worst punishment he could have imagined, exactly what he was trying to get out of doing. It undermines everything he tried to accomplish in setting up Walt.
And then Walt just telling Jessie about watching his girlfriend die ... WOW! I've been wondering when that would come back to bite him in the ass, but once Jessie lost it over the boy/ricin, I figured he had enough motivation to hate Walt and they'd just drop it. I had NO IDEA that they were saving it for one more gut-punch narrative turn where Walt volunteers the information in order to hurt his betrayer. Holy shit! That's brilliant.
Walt had dug those graves and didn't even know it. Kind of symbolic of his entire meth career, isn't it?
Jessie being forced to cook again is probably the worst punishment he could have imagined, exactly what he was trying to get out of doing. It undermines everything he tried to accomplish in setting up Walt.
And then Walt just telling Jessie about watching his girlfriend die ... WOW! I've been wondering when that would come back to bite him in the ass, but once Jessie lost it over the boy/ricin, I figured he had enough motivation to hate Walt and they'd just drop it. I had NO IDEA that they were saving it for one more gut-punch narrative turn where Walt volunteers the information in order to hurt his betrayer. Holy shit! That's brilliant.
Success will be my revenge -- DJT
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I'm Murrin
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Yeah, I think now that they're doing the final episodes ever, they're really free to just go all out in tearing things apart.
Spoiler
Todd continues to be a nice guy who is somehow also totally casual about murder, torture, kidnapping. It's kinda weird.
Jesse is totally broken, and the way they did this to him: didn't say a word, just brought him in and expected he'd understand. Placing the photograph where he'll see it but not actually drawing his attention to it. A really casual, confident approach to completely tormenting and subjugating a human being.
(Also a nice touch from the writers - Walt gave them everything without realising what he was doing. He gave them Jesse, he gave them the money, he gave them the means to coerce Jesse, because all he thought about was himself, his safety and his guilt.)
So, what's going to happen with the recording of Jesse's confession, which the gang knows is in the Schrader house - and Marie knows about it too? What will Huell say when the police finally notice he's still in protective custody (he knows things about Skyler's involvement)?
Jesse is totally broken, and the way they did this to him: didn't say a word, just brought him in and expected he'd understand. Placing the photograph where he'll see it but not actually drawing his attention to it. A really casual, confident approach to completely tormenting and subjugating a human being.
(Also a nice touch from the writers - Walt gave them everything without realising what he was doing. He gave them Jesse, he gave them the money, he gave them the means to coerce Jesse, because all he thought about was himself, his safety and his guilt.)
So, what's going to happen with the recording of Jesse's confession, which the gang knows is in the Schrader house - and Marie knows about it too? What will Huell say when the police finally notice he's still in protective custody (he knows things about Skyler's involvement)?
Todd is simply a pleasant, professional, pragmatic sociopath. Todd gets shit done.
I thought of Hank as a doofus for 4 full seasons. Hank ended up not being a doofus, which is nice.
Walt's phone call was f'n amazing.
I thought of Hank as a doofus for 4 full seasons. Hank ended up not being a doofus, which is nice.
Walt's phone call was f'n amazing.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." - PJ O'Rourke
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"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
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_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
_____________
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I'm Murrin
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I don't know that he did. A pragmatic sociopath would understand that there's no gain in making another enemy.I'm Murrin wrote:An actual sociopath wouldn't have shed a tear at Walt's grief.
I also believe that Todd is jealous of Jesse's relationship with Walt.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." - PJ O'Rourke
_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
_____________
_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
_____________
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I'm Murrin
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I just don't know. On the one hand, I think it's clear that Todd, such as he's capable of it, loves Walt. Further, I think his desire for Walt's approval, and his jealousy of Jesse as Walt's surrogate son, has driven many of his actions.I'm Murrin wrote:You think the bit where he was wiping his eyes and trying not to let anyone else notice wasn't genuine? Walt was on the floor not paying attention to anything at that point.
So I don't know. I think the tears could well be his anger towards Jesse for not realizing how lucky he is to be loved by Walt and/or his happiness that Walt has finally kicked Jesse to the curb.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." - PJ O'Rourke
_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
_____________
_____________
"Men and women range themselves into three classes or orders of intelligence; you can tell the lowest class by their habit of always talking about persons; the next by the fact that their habit is always to converse about things; the highest by their preference for the discussion of ideas." - Charles Stewart
_____________
"I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." - James Madison
_____________
I'm Murrin wrote:Yeah, I think now that they're doing the final episodes ever, they're really free to just go all out in tearing things apart.
Spoiler
Todd continues to be a nice guy who is somehow also totally casual about murder, torture, kidnapping. It's kinda weird.
Jesse is totally broken, and the way they did this to him: didn't say a word, just brought him in and expected he'd understand. Placing the photograph where he'll see it but not actually drawing his attention to it. A really casual, confident approach to completely tormenting and subjugating a human being.
(Also a nice touch from the writers - Walt gave them everything without realising what he was doing. He gave them Jesse, he gave them the money, he gave them the means to coerce Jesse, because all he thought about was himself, his safety and his guilt.)
So, what's going to happen with the recording of Jesse's confession, which the gang knows is in the Schrader house - and Marie knows about it too? What will Huell say when the police finally notice he's still in protective custody (he knows things about Skyler's involvement)?
Spoiler
Didn't Jesse cry out to Todd that he'd given them the tape as Todd was chaining him up?