Two *searing* chapters (Spoiler for 1st Chrons & TWL)

[aliantha]

Durris -- nice job! I'm not sure I would add anything, even if I could!

[Durris]

Matrixman wrote:

Durris, I want to apologize in case you felt that you were pressured to reveal your gender. You must have been amused by all the "his" and "hers" flying around when you were being referenced. This just points to a peculiar inadequacy of the English language: the lack of a unisex pronoun. "It" obviously will not do!

*fractional shrug, the one Bannor used for a small, nonverbal Tan-Haruchail*

No apology is necessary. I've been playing an ambivalent game of hide-and-seek all along...and I may owe an apology of my own to any Watchers whose radar I jammed.

If you've read The Left Hand of Darkness and/or either of LeGuin's "Is Gender Necessary?" essays, you may think of me as a Gethenian Haruchai if you wish...though there are hardly two less similar peoples in the entirety of F/SF.

[Edinburghemma]

Durris, do you have a take on Reflection theory or the Disappearing Woman premise in literature? I would be interested to know your opinion on them. I think the former has been discredited by a lot of academics whereas the latter still holds true (to my mind anyway). In fact I think that fantasy/sci fi is one of the genres where the disappearing woman is not prevalent. What do you think?

[Durris]

Please enlighten me! I'm not familiar with either Reflection theory or the Disappearing Woman premise...I majored in bio, not English (my current, fairly new, career is my humanities side staging a mutiny against being sat on for decades), and though I sometimes now publish in "English-major" journals, I'm definitely still an amateur when it comes to the theories used in literary criticism.

[Edinburghemma]

reflection theory (in anutshell) I think applies to an author writing only a reflection of how they see the world, i.e. a writer cannot be separated from their subconscious opinions on people/environment. It is widely applied to the avant-garde and post-modernists, who obviously write in an abstract way and/or try to alienate themselves from the dominant cultural mode also to shock the conventional reader.
I met an academic recently who is one of the few people to research disappearing women in lit. The idea being that in much of literature the female character (the main one or one of) disappears in some fashion by the end of the book. What at first appearances is a story about a woman turns out to be a story about a man and his view of the woman. She becomes his adjunct. Unfortunately, one doesn't like to generalise or use gender as a perspective, but after in depth research, it turns out that the theory applies to male writers in the main- Why would this be? I have been trying to apply this to f/sf, but don't know if the theory holds true, as it appears to do in 'mainstream' lit (whatever that is). Can youthink of any writers guilty of this? what do you think?

[Durris]

While I won't presume to pronounce on F/SF generally, off the top of my head SRD seems like a conspicuous (or as he'd say, cynosural) example of a story with a non-disappearing woman. In the 2nd Chrons., the male protagonist dies, for heaven's sake, and the female protagonist survives him. And Linden is far from a "supporting actress". Her role is more like the second channel in stereophonic sound...and then there's all the interpersonal development between them. Not a traditional romance subplot, though they do become lovers; each is so established in his/her resigned isolation that arriving at a genuine I-Thou interchange is improbable and eucatastrophic when it happens.

Thanks for alerting me to these theories; now I have search keywords for the next time I use Arts and Humanities Citation Index.

[Fist and Faith]

Foamfollower doesn't mention whether the ships of the Unhomed were wood or stone in LFB's The Unhomed. But it could be a simple thing. Maybe the stone that was perfect for building Coercri and Revelstone didn't make good dromonds. Maybe they always knew how to make wooden ships too, but the specific granite that Starfare's Gem was made of was superior, and they used that when they could.

It's also possible that they never saw redwood and teak trees until they got to the Land. Maybe this was actually better than their home's granite. Maybe the Search Giants would have said, "Hey! This stuff is great! Let's start using this."

[duchess of malfi]

Emma & Durris, we also can't forget the importance of a central female character in Donaldson's other two major fantasy/science fiction series...Terisa in Mordant's Need (in fact, the two books show a change in that society, elevating the roles of women), and Morn in the Gap...there is also an important central strong female character in his novella Daughter of Regals...

[danlo]

Hey I was inferring that Fist! sorta... (I was going to say that you're "stealing my thunder" but after my rude comment to Durris I had better be careful! )

[Fist and Faith]

Ah, sorry danlo! I hadn't read that part of your post. I thought you were just joking around about cookies and diets, and went on to the next post.

As for the talk of Fire and Durris being more Giantish than Haruchian in rl, I think I am also. So no stroke! I approve of the Giants' ways more than I do the Haruchai. But the Giants are too easy to understand and love. I don't love the Haruchai less, but they are difficult to understand at times. Therefore I've always championed them, so people don't miss their nobility, honor, and passion.

(Note, however, that I love the Giants enough to have started the For the Giants thread more than a year ago, soon after joining. I doubt it's possible to identify strongly with, or love, the Haruchai, but not the Giants.)

And just to clear something up... The Haruchai appear to be very similar to the Vulcans, but they are actually very different. Vulcans do everything they can (meditation, logic exercises, etc) to rid themselves of their emotions. Their goal is to act according to pure logic. Without emotion, they are, quite naturally, unanimated.

The Haruchai, otoh, are fiercely emotional. They feel extravagantly, and act on those emotions. However, they do not like to express these emotions with facial expressions, vocal inflections, and that kind of thing. So they appear the same as Vulcans.

[danlo]

I pay you a glowing compliment (or did you miss that too?) and you brush my posts off like so much cookie crumbs? You snob! Now I see the real you! **Fenesters back to Icefall to mope**Well, remind me to overlook your senseless drivel in the future!

[Durris]

Danlo wrote:

In The Riddle-Master of Hed

I went straight out and bought a copy after reading your post...thanks for the recommendation!!

Suddenly I feel like I have A-Rod in the lineup for TOT dissection--you can have whatever chapters you want in WGW after a post like that. Folks like you, Xar, Furls and Fist (just for example) wake up we poor battlescared vets who don't know what more to say. There is plenty more to be said. Thanks-WOW!

*bows deeply*

I wasn't brushing off your post, truly. Being tongue-tied is nearer the truth.

*shifts shoulders slightly in an attempt to balance the load of honor, limps off bent half-over under its weight*

Who is A-Rod? I haven't read the Gap series.

[danlo]

You're kidding right? You don't know who A-Rod is ? Alex Rodriguez--the greatest professional baseball player in the world? (well, u r a girl! )

[Durris]

That's right (Can someone make us an emoticon of two X-chromosomes?)

Not only that, but gym class sometimes ruined my report card; I don't follow sports too much. No blasphemies were intended!

[Furls Fire]

OH Fist!! I didn't mean you don't love the Giants too! I just meant you are more "into" the Haruchai than I am. (I was just kidding about the stroke..hehehe).

[Fist and Faith]

Eh?? I didn't take it any way other than you meant it!


Danlo, though I can see that nothing I say will satisfy you, I thank you anyway. Yes, I saw the compliment, but didn't want to pat myself on the back by pointing it out again. The Watch means quite a bit to me, and compliments like that are appreciated more than I can say.

[Durris]

Fist wrote:

Danlo, though I can see that nothing I say will satisfy you, I thank you anyway.

Huh? Now I'm mystified--I thought Danlo's reproof was to my address!

Yes, I saw the compliment, but didn't want to pat myself on the back by pointing it out again.

That's also why I haven't individually thanked everyone; my "Yikes, folks, I was trying to do SRD justice" post was intended as a plenary thank-you, but was too far up-thread to include everyone meriting inclusion...if anyone got the impression that I was being snobbish and ungrateful in my "professionalism" that would cause me great shame. And no one does shame and indebtedness the way a Haruchai can.

The Watch means quite a bit to me, and compliments like that are appreciated more than I can say.

I feel the same. This community is coming to be a larger part of my world than I expected when I signed up.

I derived more satisfaction from writing this post than any project I've written since my book was finished last fall, and everyone's response has tested the limits of my ability to accept affirmation. Blessings to one and all.

[danlo]

I pay you a glowing compliment (or did you miss that too?) and you brush my posts off like so much cookie crumbs? You snob! Now I see the real you! **Fenesters back to Icefall to mope**Well, remind me to overlook your senseless drivel in the future!

That was for Fist--but notice how he accepted the compliment but STILL refuses to acknowledge my post! Christ! He leaches my lifeblood and I must hurl at a cinderblock wall to become the exploding snail-dung he truly is!!!!

The A-Rod compliment was for you Durris (beware of flying snail dung! )

[Durris]

Danlo wrote:

The A-Rod compliment was for you Durris (beware of flying snail dung! )

*Durris dodges with an elegant, Baryshnikovian leap and twist, catches Fist and sets him on his feet, and bows to both combatants*

Er, gentlemen--is it not usual to ask permission telepathically before conducting ritual combat on a third party's territory?

[Durris]

*bump* Lament, given your response to "Runnik's Tale," this take on "Tull's Tale" may interest you.