Kevin's Watch

You would need to know someone really well, and they would need to be really experienced in dealing with the effects of hallucinagenics in order for it to be even thinkable that you could 'spike' them with acid, and it not be the most stupid, dangerous act against another individual you had ever carried out. It's a non-starter.

The hallucinagenic class of drugs give, out in front, the most dangerous of all the differerent types of 'high' that drugs can induce. The hallucinogenic high is the one baby that comes with no guarentee that if you 'sit it out', you will come out and find yourself still the same person you were when you went in. It's the one high where you truly do, albeit for a brief time, enter a totally different reality, an 'altered state' if you like, from the one that you normally occupy. The term 'hallucinogenic' to describe the high [too small a word] that this class of drugs gives is a misnomer. The hallucinations, when and if they appear, are the least significant thing of the whole experience; it's the 'dislocation', the side-ways kick, that it gives to your experience of reality that is the mind-f***er. Rightly is a 'bad-trip' a thing to be feared and feared greatly; you really are that close to the asylum door when that mother strikes and the chances are you're going to need some serious help to put it back in the can. So the advice always has to be don't do these types of drugs.

Shrooms tend to be much 'cleaner' on the system and hence you suffer less of a come-down, and also less hallucinagenic than acid. The length of 'trip' can be controlled much beter as well - a small number will produce a quick, short trip [3 - 4 hours ish] where a larger number will produce a deeper and longer experience. One of the main dangers with any 'trip' however, is not 'doing too much', but conversely, not doing enough. The 'trip' experience is so 'other', so away from where you normally are, that one of the worst things can be actually getting stuck half-way between the 'here' and the 'there'. It was often said that one of the best ways of dealing with a bad trip was to take more acid [or whatever]. This takes mega-balls to do when your being shredded by a bad case of acid meltdown, but in effect serves to punch you over the threshold into the place you should be, rather than in the halfey-halfey word of neither tripping and neither not. Geometric patterns and other visual phenomena are fun at times, but can be a real bore if they go on, and on, and on, for hours with nothing else happening. [Did anyone ever have 'letter trip's'].

I came out early one morning and I could 'see'. [I could percieve every pattern of growth of every blade of grass and every leaf of every tree.I could see how all the clouds fit together with every piece of sky; I could see where all had come from and where all were going. natures great pattern lay revealed before me.] Was I experiencing a transcendentant vision of the universe as it really was, or fooling myself with a drug induced delusion. Neither. It was acid; end off.

Consider the shift in culture from 1963 to 1968. 5 years. That tells you about the power of LSD, and why it scared the establishment so badly.

Do you mean culture in the broader sense here Doc [I'm thinking you do] rather than just 'an artistic shift' in terms of music, literature and art?

It all sort of started with 'the beat generation' I suppose, who spearheaded the new awareness and that led into the 'flower people and hippie phenomena'. From the states point of view the most dangerous thing that arose from this new feeling of empowerment of the up and coming generation, I suppose, would be that for the first time they were dealing with a populace that would say 'No!'. This change from the almost blind obedience to the dictat of the state, that had led millions to their deaths in WW's 1, 2 and Korea was suddenly upon them in the form of a youth that would no longer have it and was prepared for the first time to defy the call-up [to Viet-Nam]. I guess LSD played it's part in this, but would it not have happened anyway?

Good post, Pete.

Hallucinagens may have been the genesis of the very first primitive religions. I don't think it's an accident that even an atheist like myself describes the experience as "religious" or "spiritual." Mankind certainly would have come in contact with hallucinagenic plants long before he was able to even speak, much less develop a system of religious memes. Even animals trip. In fact, some cultures trip by drinking the urine of animals who have eaten shrooms.

In the Future of the Mind thread (Loresraat) I noted that there is a part of the brain that once stimulated electronically will induce a "religious" experience. Our brains are definitely wired for this type of experience, and there seem to be various triggers. I don't think it's a hallucination, no more than consciousness itself. It's just another way to awaken to the world. In fact, our curiosity in altering our consciousness may have even driven the evolution of our consciousness. Even children want to alter their minds. That's why they think it's fun to spin in circles until they're dizzy. Realizing that you have this power over your own reality is the awakening of the self.

peter wrote:Do you mean culture in the broader sense here Doc [I'm thinking you do] rather than just 'an artistic shift' in terms of music, literature and art?

It all sort of started with 'the beat generation' I suppose, who spearheaded the new awareness and that led into the 'flower people and hippie phenomena'. From the states point of view the most dangerous thing that arose from this new feeling of empowerment of the up and coming generation, I suppose, would be that for the first time they were dealing with a populace that would say 'No!'. This change from the almost blind obedience to the dictat of the state, that had led millions to their deaths in WW's 1, 2 and Korea was suddenly upon them in the form of a youth that would no longer have it and was prepared for the first time to defy the call-up [to Viet-Nam]. I guess LSD played it's part in this, but would it not have happened anyway?

I think LSD was a significant amplifying element of the social changes during that time frame. Anyone who has done it (including yours truly) can confirm that even 1 experience will raise your overall level of consciousness. And consider that one of the primary effects of the drug is to sweep away walls of denial. In effect, the generations before had been boxed in by these walls of denial, none of which can survive LSD. Many of the beat figures you mention and other members of the cultural vanguard of the 60s embraced the experimental use of LSD as a general prescription for raised consciousness. So I don't think it is an exaggeration to suggest that much of the empowerment you describe is rooted in the use of LSD, either by direct experience or indirectly by the leadership of those who found their experiences with it illuminating.

Here's an odd little 'acid tale' [we've all got them] that somewhat illustrates the weirdness that constitutes a trip. A group of us [about eight or so IIRC] were in a room and had done a microdot apiece and were well into the fun. We noticed that one of the group [Nigel] seemed to be talking gibberish, which we all thought was funny. There were words coming out of him with clearly an idea behind them - but he made no sense. I was sat next to him and realised that he was getting agitated at not being able to communicate his thinking to us, so in order to avoid any 'badness' creeping into his trip I decided to concentrate on him fully and see if I could breach this communicatory wall that seemed to be isolating him from the rest of the group. It took a while; I listened really hard to what he was saying - and then, bang, all of a sudden I got it. I turned exitedly to the rest of the group proclaiming my success in elucidating meaning from Nigel's verbal nonsense ......... and now it became me that was talking the gibberish. Now Nigel and I could understand eachother, but not the rest of the group - and they could not understand us. Slowly I explanid the thing to one of the other members, and bingo - all of a sudden he was on our side of the communication divide. The process continued one by one untill there were two groups, each with no understanding of the other, and then untill finally one member was left in a state of uncomprehension and talking gibberish. At last he was coaxed over the wall of confusion and into the light of understanding and the process was complete. It took some three or four hours I would guess [who can tell - hell it was acid!] by which time it was six o clock in the morning and we all went off home to our respective beds.

This seemed an appropriate place to drop this article.

Scientists Might Have Finally Figured out How LSD Works

Another intriguing result was that the scans revealed that the LSD interrupts a major circuit between four parts of the brain, including the thalamus, which acts as an information filter. Essentially, the drug allowed more information to flow through the thalamus to other parts of the brain.

Validating, I might add, my long held theory that LSD strips you of your filters.

Will probably be a similar effect with Psilocybin, perhaps to a lesser degree etc.

Pretty cool. Huxley was onto something.

--A

Tunol was the drug for stripping away filters

Man that was a frightening one to mess with.

Being a goody two shoes, Ive never experimented with acid or any other drug in my youth. Though it is an interesting development that scientists have identified that LSD effects the thalamus... allowing more data to flood the brain.

How interesting is that? If consciousness developed through exposure to data what would the long term effect of greater data reception be on human evolution, if any at all

Well, we spent all that time evolving to reduce the amount of information we were getting. (Or at least, process it without paying attention to it.) So...not sure...



--A