Kevin's Watch

..well duh!...puttin a smile on ones face and saying "Hi!" gets a slap in the face everytime....relax.....geez...MEL

lurch wrote:...puttin a smile on ones face and saying "Hi!" gets a slap in the face everytime...

In your case lurch, I can well believe it !

...Well,,the last " Wall Flowers R US" convention I gave a lecture at ,indicated to me, that indeed ,some get " lucky". Yes, some women know what they want and as long as the wanted acquiesses, the women get what and who they want. Very Good. Sounds like a natural fit.

As to my own starring attraction,,well,,like indicated all along,,there is an art to it. And as indicated here by most others correctly,,it does have alot to do with reading the subtleties of many types of language and responding accordingly. Each person is unique in their abilities.

As far as getting an actual slap in the face,,yes, once in a bar ,,it was Americas 200 the birthday as I recall..a friend mind you,,pinched the buttocks of a party goer next to me. She being 3 sheets to the wind, just turned and swung, with no regards to ,,well anything. I was talking to another woman partyier, and then I saw stars. My then friend cowarded and ran away. Anyway, the woman I was shmoozing with took pity on me and things worked out anyhow for me.....MEL

Alynna Lis Eachann wrote:And I have no problem slapping random men who take the initiative without permission.

Initiative -- As Inigo Montoya might say, 'I do not think it means what you think it means.' (If you have to wait for permission, it is not taking the initiative.)

Wayfriend wrote:

Alynna Lis Eachann wrote:And I have no problem slapping random men who take the initiative without permission.

Initiative -- As Inigo Montoya might say, 'I do not think it means what you think it means.' (If you have to wait for permission, it is not taking the initiative.)

Ordinarily, I'd agree.

However, in the case of attraction and (proper) flirtation, there are so many levels of advance and acceptance that, by the time you get around to a "slappable offence," youd've ignored or skipped so many steps where permission had not been given as to be labelled a complete ass - and therefore worthy of a slap.

EDIT: Of course, I've been slapped as well - so what do I know? (In my own defence, it was for a percieved and not actual round of flirtation. It was delivered by my date, and she thought I was flirting with someone else...)

..Okay,,okay,,okay..I see the thread has made a subtle shift and yes, it is related...

I'll cut to the bottom line of where this appears to be going. In any relationship there is the Dominant and subdominant. IMHO, a healthy relationship is one where the two are interchanged between the partners. From sex, to house cleaning, to bill paying, kids, food, etc,etc,etc,etc it is not wise nor healthy for one member of a relationship to always be the dominant. A free exchange of the roles between the partners allows for the 3rd abstract to develop,,and that is the idea, the result,,of the unseen , unthought of..to become the thought of, the seen. or..two heads are better than one. Creativity shared by two ,solves alot of problems.

But , again , this thread i didn't see starting on the married couple or life partner marker. I see Male Virginity as not entirely controlled by the Male. If it is to be maintained, then yes, it is controlled soley by the beholder. But if it is to be ended with,,then there is required an accepting 2nd party.
My opinions are from the Male perspective of the process. I have read from more than one source,,that in all reality, we males only deceive ourselves in believing we " control' or we start. The female in all her wyle ways actually controls from the start,,and we are allowed to think that we capture our mates. Could be. Then I don't feel so bad about escaping then,,because, obviously I was allowed.. No guilt there........MEL

I have always believed that any woman can get as much sex as she wants as long as she's willing to be flexible about her standards for beauty, hygiene, personality, and relationship quality.

This is a shame, because in general, women aren't willing to lower their standards in these areas simply in order to "get some." Many men don't care particularly about these things in a sexual partner--in a girlfriend yes, but not a sexual partner. However, there seems to be a lot of struggle and effort put in by men in order to "get some." It would seem that men simply don't have as much sexual power over women as women do over men.

Why do think the vampire legend makes such a big deal about young ladies having to "invite" the bloodsuckers before they can come inside? And why are the vampires always trying to seduce the young ladies, cloud their minds, and convince them to let....them.....in.....

Myste wrote:I have always believed that any woman can get as much sex as she wants as long as she's willing to be flexible

I totally agree with the above statement!
Flexability goes a long way.

Hi Myste,

I do agree with on your generalization that men are much more likely to be predatory than women - it is probably in our genes.

Myste wrote:This is a shame, because in general, women aren't willing to lower their standards in these areas simply in order to "get some." Many men don't care particularly about these things in a sexual partner--in a girlfriend yes, but not a sexual partner.

I think this may seem to be the case since the men looking to get whatever they can get are much more noticable to the ladies. However, I think this not truly representative in general. Most of the men that I know, including myself, need to feel a reasonable attraction (physical and mental) to a lady before being sexually interested.

Of course, I am not so much referring to teenage boys under the full rage of their hormones who are desparate to get laid for the first time. I even went through that so many years ago.

Vector wrote:Hi Myste,

I do agree with on your generalization that men are much more likely to be predatory than women - it is probably in our genes.

I agree, too. It's a biological imperative thing, I think. In order to ensure the survival of the species, men need to have the drive to go out and have sex. I don't think that guys are just animals, or have no standards or anything; I think that it's just a certain kind of chemical wiring. Women are wired more for long-term relationships because biologically, they a) have a very physical personal intimacy with their children (nothing like carrying someone around inside you for nine months), and b) their biological interests are best served by keeping the male of the species around after the birth, while they're physically recuperating from the bodily stresses of childbirth & child rearing. We all live at the mercy of chemicals and biological forces over which we have no control at all!!!

Lord Foul, you're better off out of it. Transcend the biological imperative!!!

Myste wrote:

Vector wrote:Hi Myste,

I do agree with on your generalization that men are much more likely to be predatory than women - it is probably in our genes.

I agree, too. It's a biological imperative thing, I think. In order to ensure the survival of the species, men need to have the drive to go out and have sex. I don't think that guys are just animals, or have no standards or anything; I think that it's just a certain kind of chemical wiring. Women are wired more for long-term relationships because biologically, they a) have a very physical personal intimacy with their children (nothing like carrying someone around inside you for nine months), and b) their biological interests are best served by keeping the male of the species around after the birth, while they're physically recuperating from the bodily stresses of childbirth & child rearing. We all live at the mercy of chemicals and biological forces over which we have no control at all!!!

Lord Foul, you're better off out of it. Transcend the biological imperative!!!

Better off out of what? Having children--creatures?! I agree!

Ah yes, no children-creatures for me. I'm too selfish.

Sum sui generis
Vs

Lord Foul wrote:Better off out of what? Having children--creatures?! I agree!

Well, you know that your purpose on this planet is to procreate, so why don't you put some of that product that you are generating on a daily basis to good use - and donate it to a needy clinic

And this way you can have many children-creatures, with no responsability - and validating yourself as a man, all at the same time !!!

lurch wrote:Loosing your virginity isn't something that happens to you. Loosing your virginity is something You Make Happen.

That is just a load of bollocks. I didn't set out thinking "Today I'm going to lose my virginity!" It just happened.

lurch wrote:THEN, one can start filling ones own head with BLAH BLAH

Having read all your posts in this thread, I can hardly think of a more apt statement.

Vector wrote:

Lord Foul wrote:Better off out of what? Having children--creatures?! I agree!

Well, you know that your purpose on this planet is to procreate, so why don't you put some of that product that you are generating on a daily basis to good use - and donate it to a needy clinic

Needy? There's already 6 billion of us! Why add more germs--I mean, lovely little children? Besides, all that "I'm a man" balderdash is, um, balderdash. Posturing.

Manly or not, my purpose is self-aggrandizement, laziness, and creating as many possibilities for indulgence and enjoyment as possible!

....I was wondering when some one from across the pond would let us know how they go about it,,and of course with their flair for the dry added, the thoughts are appreciated. The sherriff gave me just a sampling compared to your generousity.

But, Jr, you have brought up a good observation perhaps. It could be all cultural. After all,,my forefathers took the iniative and moved on from the Old Europe,,and perhaps , your Grands,,stayed put,just letting it happen so to speak. So, of course, there would be a difference in perspective.

Yet, the underlieing truth exists. Males are predisposed , culturally accepted and in cases, encouraged,( see LF's original post) to loose their virginity. I repeat and maintain,,there is no virtue to male virginity,,as there is applied to female virginity,,and even that is fast disappearing,,because, as hinted at in some former posts by others, women ( as in your case i suppose, so well demonstrates) , they really do control the situation as to a man loosing his virginity,,at least in a civilized society. So some modern women do not accept the double standard, bravo for them , imho, and have no problem taking matters into their own hands. So, unless an outrite conscience decision is made by a fellow to not have sex, males are predisposed.

The escalating levels of hormones in our bodys during the teenage years is Nature encouraging us to act. Yet, as noted just above, according to some analysis, one out of a hundred, has no sex drive. ..oh well. Every one of us sees ourselves as well rounded individuals. " Take the iniative," " Just Happen", magic moment, you'll know it when its rite, on and on, are all just reflections of the basic truth. Males aren't expected to remain virgins. The Old Testament makes point of Men being demonstratably Men by the quanity of wives and concubines. Sure it was written by Men, but still reflects the culture. I don't know of any parents of 20 or 30 year old male virgins who boast about it, like they do or would if it was a daughter they were talking about.
So,,if any man is not expected to remain a virgin, then what is the problem with " just do it" ? Across the bell curve, how is that advice any different than, the warm and fuzzy and mystical , "you'll know when",,"some one special", " just happened",etc? Thats just cultural dressing on a Natural Fact. We are born with the bollockers. There is a statistical deviation applied to the population. But the subject is, and has to do with, having sex. I Suggest, anybody with absolutely no sex drive,,none whatso ever,,to go to a Doctor and get some doctoring. The issue is way beyond anything anybody can say here. But if you got the slitest incling..just do it.

..and LF..as many opportunities..??..more blind man telling me about the color blue.... ..having sex should be the 1st opportunity you take care of..then you have a natural standard that all others can be compared to...btw..having sex and having children are two different topics....

Maybe a reading of the Zen thread would help.......MEL

Hmm, I must say that Lurch has at least one good point there, in that there is no difference between the advice to wait and take it easy, and the advice to try and do something about it. (Actually, the one about kids being a seperate conversation is true too.)

That said though, the latter does have strong overtones of some sort of machismo, which is just as "expected".

In the end, who the hell cares? The only person it affects right now is Foul, and as long as he's happy, then that is what counts.

One thing though, is that for all the saying that it doesn't matter, you only find out that you were right, once you've done it.

--Avatar

I've come to the conclusion that I don't need sex. Sure, I want to have it, but I think I'll be fine with or without. I won't let sex control my life; I have higher priorities (getting my book published, going to college and maintaining good grades, not becoming a compulsive buyer, etc.)

I might not become a "registered man", and my pipes may not be clean, but hey--ya win some ya lose some. I came here indecisive about where I stood (mainly because I'd never thought about it much; usually, I have a stance on everything). Sex is honestly not that important to me. If it were, I'd have sought it out long ago.

lurch wrote:....I was wondering when some one from across the pond would let us know how they go about it

I ventured my opinion way back. You must have missed it.

He-Man wrote:But, Jr, you have brought up a good observation perhaps. It could be all cultural. After all,,my forefathers took the iniative and moved on from the Old Europe,,and perhaps , your Grands,,stayed put,just letting it happen so to speak. So, of course, there would be a difference in perspective.

Yeeeeeeeeeeees. I may take a little more convincing than that before I believe my happiness with myself regardless of the state of my loins is some kind of ancestral hangover.

Basically, I think you are far, far too focused on sex and virginity, to an almost unhealthy extent.

You keep making the argument that it's unnatural not to have sex. Since the wish to refrain from that particular act, or the indifference to it, is a product of the human brain, are you implying that our brains are not part of nature - that the human brain is artificial? Manufactured?

Yes, that's a silly argument, but I use it to highlight the equal silliness of your assertion that we must all have sex because it's "natural". If we have evolved to a point where we can choose, then maintaining virginity is as natural as not doing so. Having said that, perhaps getting your end away as a matter of urgency is natural for you; after all, you appear not to have evolved beyond the chest-beating neanderthal stage.

...Some interesting points you bring up Jr.

..aaam, in a thread concerning male virginity (adult),,exactlt what subject Should I be focused on? LF has taken an (imho) extreme position on it, thats okay,but the counter extreme is not. Thanks for demonstration of double standard.That LF's " decision" hasn't been perceived for its extremity, tells me alot about folks.

Again , perhaps you surface the real issue here. the naturalness of having sex,,its natural origin, sub-civilization, perhaps bothers folks. I see it as , and have made reference to it already, as what we have in common with all living things. In other words, we are still linked to the " animal" by our sex. We can kink-a-fy it all we want in vain attempt to make it " Human",,apply affectations of civilization to doing "it"..but when i come along and remind how natural, how part of the animal kingdom having sex is,,then I am the chest thumper. Well duh! I acknowledge it. My question to LF and I guess, you , is..why do you deny it?

In this thread on male sexual virginity..it appears that opinions stated have been assumed to mirror thoughts and behavior 24/7. The assumption is wrong. My stated opinions concern male loosing virginity.
A 20 yr old started the thread,,was congratulated for having the nerve to bring the subject to the site. I give him the same that I am sure any of his friends or family have already gave him, and I'm the bad guy...? Sorry, I cannot re-inforce his behavior or lack of. I see his decision to be based on nothing substantial or redemptive. The reasoning comes across as fear laden Sloth,,and that should not be re-inforced,,especially when , with a little effort, the rewarding attributes of having sex are so pleasureful. just to get LF off his duff and at least looking at a more middle ground stance, apparently exceeds in effort more extreme than I have been.

It appears to me that LF came here with the subject, to get re-inforced for his decision. I can not re-inforce that behavior for the sake of PC. like Ralphie May puts it..I m not politically correct, I'm just correct....MEL