The Secret of Immortality

[Esmer]

You Cannot Die

not the definition: but the secret itself!


It has been said that the most extraordinary wisdom is also the most simplistic. Altho, is it the words themselves that are simple? The meaning?

What IS the secret of Immortality, or is there even one at all? And, if there IS, what would it be? How would you recognize it without using the ordinary and simple words necessary to convey it? What makes wisdom, and words wise, and secrets revealed?

Is it the knowledge behind them that is required to reveal them?

Why does the most wise always appear to be most simple, yet require the most complex and comprehensive understanding, a wealth of knowing to achieve such a simple thought, so spare yet so powerful?

Is knowledge power? Are words?

definitions change as knowledge increases

So, there you have it....The Secret of Immortality....now:

Is seeing knowing? Is believing knowing? What good are secrets, if you don't know what they mean, or believe them when you see them? OR, perhaps most importantly of all: act upon them?

[drew]

I don't see any reason to even want imortality.

Death is just part of life (the last part none-the-less; but still a part)

Unless you consider things like references of people of the past as the key to imortality..in that case, there would be many expamples of Imortal...Bodha, Jesus, Mohammad, Leonardo DaVinci (even BEFORE Dan Brown came along), Picaso...so many many others.

Not to mention memories of loved ones; I knwo a great deal about my great Grandfather, how he imagrated to Halifax, though he died a half a century before I was born...his memory still lives through me.
Plus ther's a bit of me in each of my sons, as they grow old and possibly have children of their own, not only will my memory be solidified; but the memories I have for my Great Grandfather will too be further imortalized, thus keeping him alive even longer.

But as far as the possibility of finding a way to never die? I don't see a reason or a want or a need. Even the profits and religous dieties (ficticious or not) have all physically died...there is no reason for them to have lived.

Leave the everlasting lives to Tokien's elves, and mortality to us mortals.

[Esmer]

you bring up a good point drew. What does Immortality mean itself? It seems totally dependent upon the individual, eh? So, Immortality to the secret giver may mean something different than the secret receiver, eh? and that the first rule of knowing is wanting to know?

[drew]

Since I was the one who brought it up, let's look at the world of Tolkien.

Elves can live forever, if nothing happens to them--but the Can be killed.

Gandalph probebly has some sort of a life span; but was able to return from death.

Isildur was mortal; died, but his heir eventually took up his rightfull place to continue his reign.

Which one's are Imortal?

[Esmer]

well, the difference is between physical and "spiritual" here, eh? What are you? A physical organic mass, or a specific configuration of conscious energy?

[drew]

What, you have to pick?

I am a phiscal organic mass, carbon bassed with Deoxyribonucleic acid spesific for me in each of my cells.
I am a lifeform that reatcs responses to stimuli, and am very fragile and vunerable.

I am also a spesific configuration of concious energies, both inherited and learned. These energies are stored, used grown and multiplied.

One day when the physical shell finally gives out, it will return it's matter to the earth, but the enrgies will escape into the collective of all energies throughout the earth (or beyond) and I will become part of everything...as will you my friend.

[Menolly]

One day when the physical shell finally gives out, it will return it's matter to the earth, but the enrgies will escape into the collective of all energies throughout the earth (or beyond) and I will become part of everything...as will you my friend.

So then there is immortality.

[Esmer]

What, you have to pick?

I am a phiscal organic mass, carbon bassed with Deoxyribonucleic acid spesific for me in each of my cells.
I am a lifeform that reatcs responses to stimuli, and am very fragile and vunerable.

I am also a spesific configuration of concious energies, both inherited and learned. These energies are stored, used grown and multiplied.

One day when the physical shell finally gives out, it will return it's matter to the earth, but the enrgies will escape into the collective of all energies throughout the earth (or beyond) and I will become part of everything...as will you my friend.

I don't believe that is guaranteed, my friend, however likely that really is going to happen to me, and us......but some say otherwise, and say what you say is not true, or doesn't have to be true......who do I believe?

The one that most closely matches my experience? In my experience there is no Immortality, but in their experience there is......if I truly wanted to know what they mean, or if it's true, mustn't I also make my experience like theirs? Know what they know? Make their Truth my Truth?

[drew]

Like Esm--er I mean Father Grigori said,, it depends on how you look at it.

My view is kind of a varience on the Christian Heaven..but differnt in the sence that once your brain dies, I don't think you can go on realizing what is hapening.

So if you lived a positive life, that positivity will be translated into the life enrgy of all living things once you die-and increase the overall possitivnisity(!) of the universe (Heaven)
If you lived a negative life; once your energies are released, they will feed the negative energies of the universe making them just a little bit stronger (hell)

But as far as being concious of what is going on...I don't beleive so.

It's such a dificult questionj to answer, imortality.

I mean Einstein died, he's dead, but every breath of air we take, could have some remnants of him in it.

[Esmer]

aaaahhh, but the secret is that you cannot allow your brain to die....with you in it....

...you are an awareness encased here *taps chest*...I am trying to convince you it is possible to get out of it...

[drew]

The one that most closely matches my experience? In my experience there is no Immortality, but in their experience there is......if I truly wanted to know what they mean, or if it's true, mustn't I also make my experience like theirs? Know what they know? Make their Truth my Truth?

Well in order to beleive in something, I fell you do have to BELEIVE it.
You must have heard people quip, "I don't beleive in God, but I go to church, just in case I'm wrong."--all joking aside, thy're still unbelievers (heh) and they're not fooling anyone, least of all themselves.

I've also heard, "I beleive in God, but what if I picked the wrong one to beleive in." meaning, I guess the wrong religion...well no religion is the the wrong religion, if you strongly beleive in it.

The same goes with your conudrum of imortality...If you want to beleive in it, you'll have to ignore or change the attitudes inside of you that are telling you it can't happen, or you'll never truly believe.

The further hit my point home, reread the First Chronicles of Thomas Covenant (a good series if you haven't already picked it up) replace TC's name with your own, and replace the domain The Land, with Heaven or Imortality.

[Menolly]

My belief in the possibility of immortality/an afterlife is best summed up in the last few pages of the last book of the children's series about bats by Kenneth Oppel, Silverwing, Sunwing, and Firewing.

[Marv]

The one who saw all I will declare to the world,
The one who knew all I will tell about
He saw the great Mystery, he knew the Hidden
He recovered the knowledge of all the times before the Flood.
He journeyed beyond the distant, he journeyed beyond exhaustion,
And then carved his story on stone.

Your referencing the story of Gilgamesh right, Es?

[Esmer]

Your referencing the story of Gilgamesh right, Es?

I've never read the story of Gilgamesh, but it's possible.....

I am referencing a "collection" of sources, tazz....

The same goes with your conudrum of imortality...If you want to beleive in it, you'll have to ignore or change the attitudes inside of you that are telling you it can't happen, or you'll never truly believe.

The further hit my point home, reread the First Chronicles of Thomas Covenant (a good series if you haven't already picked it up) replace TC's name with your own, and replace the domain The Land, with Heaven or Imortality.

I already did that when I was 12, drew....

excellent point re: having to believe...

To further hit my point home, reread the Nag Hammadi(a good series if you haven't already picked it up) replace JC's name with your own....

To further hit my point home, reread the Teachings of Don Juan(a good series if you haven't already picked it up) replace CC's name with your own....

I could go on....

[drew]

aaaahhh, but the secret is that you cannot allow your brain to die....with you in it....

...you are an awareness encased here *taps chest*...I am trying to convince you it is possible to get out of it...

So you let go of your soul before your body dies huh?

Maybe that's what happens to elders who suffer from Altzeimers or Dimentia?

Maybe that's the behaviour of a body with no soul?

[Esmer]

perhaps, but.....

let go?





Take Control





Q. how does one take control?

A. by abandoning oneself!

[Marv]

So you let go of your soul before your body dies huh?

Maybe that's what happens to elders who suffer from Altzeimers or Dimentia?

Maybe that's the behaviour of a body with no soul?

That's really interesting. You let go of your soul in to what? You hear of great artists leaving a piece of their soul in works of art. Maybe we dont need a living vessel for our souls or a mystical place where we are all floating spirits? Maybe the key to immortality is to care and love something so much that your physical body loses it's importance.

[Fist and Faith]

I'm immortal. I guess I've never mentioned it. And if, unthinkable though it may be, I'm wrong, your "Ha ha! You were wrong! You're dead!"s will fall on extremely deaf ears.

[Marv]

I'm immortal. I guess I've never mentioned it. And if, unthinkable though it may be, I'm wrong, your "Ha ha! You were wrong! You're dead!"s will fall on extremely deaf ears.

LOL

Actually, I was thinking-Es, you watched a Highlander marathon last night didn't you?

[Sunbaneglasses]

The secret to immortality is being able not to die.