Reflections...

Post by **Wipe** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 10:16 am

I've just started reading the Runes, the prologue was great.
But when Linden entered the Land, I felt somewhat disappointed that the scenario from TWL was happening again.
Not the Sunbane of course, but the sensation of deja-vu!?

If feels like I've read this before?

But, ok... It's still in the beginning of the book so there's hopefully lot of surprises left

She just met the Haruchai and convinced them that she's really Linden Avery!
Stubborn Haruchai

Am I the only one with those feelings?

Post by **dlbpharmd** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 10:44 am

For me there was a sense of deja vu - but when you consider how many times a summoning has occured on Kevin's Watch, and someone from the Land has climbed up there to either participate or see what's going on - then that sense is only natural.

Post by **Wipe** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 12:48 pm

Why Kevins Watch every time (not this forum though

)?
Is it the gateway between the worlds? Never figured that out!
Stubborn Wipe!

Post by **dlbpharmd** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 1:20 pm

That's something I've never really understood.

One would assume that Drool Rockworm was in Mount Thunder when Covenant was summoned in LFB - but why was he placed on KW?

Elena summoned Covenant in TIW to Revelstone, and Triock and Foamfollower were on KW when Covenant was summoned in TPTP, so that makes sense that he would appear before his summoner

It's clear in TWL that a specific location in the "real world' was necessary for Covenant's summoning. But yet he and Linden ended on on KW, as Linden did in Runes.

So I don't know - I'd be glad if someone would shed some light on this for me.

Post by **CovenantJr** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 4:10 pm

Believe me, Wipe - there's plenty to be surprised at

As for Kevin's Watch as the venue... I take it to be a combination of symbolism, since it's featured so prominently in the past, and a convenient vantage point for TC/Linden to view what's become of the Land. With regards to TC's very first summoning to the Watch, my theory is twofold: 1) As mentioned above, the impact of seeing this whole other world laid out before him, and 2) I'm sure Foul new TC suffered from vertigo, so sticking him on the top of an unfeasibly high pinnacle immediately put him in a position of weakness and panic.

Post by **Aleksandr** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 4:26 pm

But when Linden entered the Land, I felt somewhat disappointed that the scenario from TWL was happening again.
Not the Sunbane of course, but the sensation of deja-vu!?

Yes, I felt that way too. Lots of parallels with TWL (but rather few with LFB other than the location itself). Like Covenant in TWL Linden is summoned to Kevin’s Watch mortally wounded, but is healed by the Wild Magic. She receives a prophecy of doom (visual rather than verbal for the most part in her case), notes that something is amiss in the Land below (Sunbane’s cororna/rain clouds in TWL; Kevin’s Dirt in Runes); is met by a mentally distutrbed person (Nassic wasn’t playing with a full deck either in TWL); is imprsioned in Mithil Stonedown, then escapes. Of course Anele isn’t murdered by a Raver as Nassic was, Liand is far more like Lena than like Sunder, and Linden’s life is not threatened by her captors. And of course Linden shows up on Kevin’s Watch alone.

One would assume that Drool Rockworm was in Mount Thunder when Covenant was summoned in LFB - but why was he placed on KW?

Perhaps to place Covenant as far from Revelstone as possible so he would have the maximum opportunity to screw things up on his way there. I doubt Foul could have foreseen the rape, but he probably figured TC would do a good deal of damage somehow.

It's clear in TWL that a specific location in the "real world' was necessary for Covenant's summoning.

Since Covnenant is summoned from four different locations in the First Chronicles (the street in the town, his living room, two places in the woods) it would seem that a summoning can occur anywhere. Also, Hile Troy was snatched from some location (near DC?) quite a distance from TC’s home. What does seem to be true is that without the Staff of Law it is only possible to summon a person who is in bad shape in the real world (TC; now Linden, Joan and probably Roger) though once the gate is opened others (Linden; now Jeremiah) can be brought along.

Post by **CovenantJr** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 5:02 pm

I'd agree with your latter comments there, regarding summoning. Without the Staff of Law, it seems summoning is a very precise and restricted act. Hence specific locations and ill health.

Post by **MacNik6** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 11:15 pm

dlbpharmd wrote:That's something I've never really understood.

One would assume that Drool Rockworm was in Mount Thunder when Covenant was summoned in LFB - but why was he placed on KW?

Elena summoned Covenant in TIW to Revelstone, and Triock and Foamfollower were on KW when Covenant was summoned in TPTP, so that makes sense that he would appear before his summoner

It's clear in TWL that a specific location in the "real world' was necessary for Covenant's summoning. But yet he and Linden ended on on KW, as Linden did in Runes.

So I don't know - I'd be glad if someone would shed some light on this for me.

Actually, TC was summoned under Mount Thunder when Drool Rockworm summoned him, then LF placed him on KW. The second chronicle's summoning was in LF's control, as was the third. It seems LF likes to put the "good" people on KW as a punishment!

Post by **Xar** » Tue Nov 02, 2004 10:43 pm

I rather had a different feeling... I mean, whenever I open the First Chronicles, and read of Covenant's first impression of the Land, I get overjoyed because it is the Land of old, the Land of Mhoram and Foamfollower and the others, and because it is objectively beautiful and wondrous. When I open the Second Chronicles, I get dismayed and horrified by what the Sunbane has inflicted upon the Land. And when I opened Runes, I felt a strange sense of... timelessness, in a way. The Haruchai stole all knowledge and lore from the people of the Land, and so the Land itself seems to be wrapped in stillness... no one is aware of any danger, no one remembers the great danger(s) - except for the Haruchai, of course... It's like the Land has "frozen" in time (because people don't "grow" through the generations without the passing of knowledge from elder to child)... and apathy, too (enforced by the Haruchai, of course, but apathy nonetheless... no one is interested in learning about the Land's past and power anymore, with the exception of Liand).

Post by **Wipe** » Fri Nov 05, 2004 2:18 pm

Ok, things are getting better and better by moment!

I mean, Haruchai, Ramen AND Ur-Viles, time-vortex-thingies?
I'm astonished!

Post by **Melenkurion** » Fri Nov 05, 2004 2:58 pm

Just had a thought about the fact that all the summonings end up on KW. Maybe at the first summoning, that particular bit of reality was kind of imprinted with the memory of the event (like a curve in space-time). Therefore, subsequent summonings naturally gravitate to that place.

Fri Nov 05, 2004 3:24 pm

The first summoning was not to KW. TC was summoned to the cave under Mount Thunder, THEN after Foul had given him his message for the Lords, he (or Drool) deposited TC on top of the Watch.

Post by **Melenkurion** » Fri Nov 05, 2004 4:56 pm

Yeah - I see what you mean, SS. However, I always had the impression that Foul redirected the summoning, rather than created his own transportation magic.

Fri Nov 05, 2004 9:13 pm

KW does seem to be a focal point for summonings, maybe because it is such a landmark? Maybe that's just another reason why we feel outraged at its destruction.

Post by **drew** » Fri Nov 05, 2004 9:33 pm

I think that it's just a good place to start from SRD's point of view as a story teller. I guess he could have sent Covenant/Linden anywhere..but in the first Chronicles, it enabled Covenant to learn about the land from Lena and Atiaran--something that wouldn't have happened if he wound up in REvelstone...or stayed in Mount Thunder--Covenant (at later Linden) need a place that is somewhat secluded (so that there isn't an audience during the summoning) but somewhere that is close to people..Mithil Stonedown.

But on that note...it's pretty amazing just how long that little village of Five Hundred People has stayed around....Seven Thousand....more like Eight thousand years.

Fri Nov 05, 2004 9:52 pm

Hmm. Must've missed where it gave a figure for population, I never reckoned it at more than a hundred people, even at it's most populous.

I guess if TC had ended up in a different place when summoned he would have had an entirely different journey. I'm sure that when SRD designed the map of the Land, he had some idea of where TC would start and where he would travel to. I reckon he drew up the map, then had TC start at a location more or less equidistant between Revelstone and Coercri (check the map) so there would be plenty of scope for adventures on his journey wherever he went.

As for TC starting from KW, it would be a bit daft if he suddenly winked into existence in the middle of the Stonedown. It allows SRD to play on TC's vertigo, it places him in a position where right from the start he has to confront his worst fears, and it just gets worse from there on in.

Post by **drew** » Sat Nov 06, 2004 11:27 am

Hmm. Must've missed where it gave a figure for population, I never reckoned it at more than a hundred people, even at it's most populous.

Lena tells TC that her village has "Five time a hundred" people.
Although, I'm sure the Clave was able to radiclly reduce the population during the Sunbane years.