Lois McMaster Bujold

[taraswizard]

Lois McMaster Bujold, Curse of Chalion, Palladin of Souls, Hallowed Hunt, starting in 2001 and HH was a 2005 published. Author has won four Hugos, more than any other author except one. I'm reading CoC and it's becoming my favorite book I've read this year (it's displaced Fistful of Sky by Nina Hofmann).

The story is one of a coutier and soldier who after spending three years as a galley slave, the consequence of a wartime betrayal, returns to the court of a provincial lord where he had spent his youth. At the court he meets the widow of the provinicial lord, who is a guardian of her grandchildern who are both half siblings of the prince and liege lord of their country. The grand mother appoints our hero to be tutor and secretary to her grandaughter. And ATT, I think it's just a wonderful read.

There must be someone else here who loves her books. And there's her Vorkosigan stories, too.

[Zahir]

Bujold is a marvelous author IMO. One of the things that is so impressive is that she takes religion and religious ideas seriously--a fairly rare thing in either SciFi or Fantasy. But that pales beside the genuinely interesting, often quirky and brilliant characters she has created and successfully lets us see.

[duchess of malfi]

She is brilliant at creating well fleshed out characters. Her Vorkosigan science fiction series is one of my all time favorites. And one of my favorite characters in Martin's Song of Ice and Fire fantasy series, Tyrion Lannister, can clearly be seen as the anti-Miles Vorkosigan.

Spoiler

Both of them have these huge, genius minds and huge amounts of energy in twisted and deformed little bodies. Both of them live in a society that does not give them the respect that they deserve, seeing them as deformed dwarves rather than brilliant men. But - Miles has these fantastic parents who love him, support him, and encourage him to become the best human being he can be. Tyrion has a horrible and emotionally abusive parent. Its fascinating comparing and contrasting these two characters - two of the most vividly created characters in all of speculative fiction.

[taraswizard]

Thanks, Duchess and Zahir for contributing to this thread.

Replying to Duchess, one of my best friends in California, thinks the religous aspects of Bujold's texts are her best parts.

Having just finished Curse of Chalion which I found to be a very complete story. I find my self wondering how I feel about there being a sequel.

Does anyone think CoC, or Bujold's texts in general, are sappy and too sentimentalistic to be a good SF or Fantasy writer? But I loved it, CoC made laugh (found some the scenes as described laugh out loud funny) and made me cry.

But maybe I'm full of crap, too.

[Zahir]

Without going into details, I can tell you Paladin of Souls does not continue to tell the story about the same characters. Its focus is on a supporting character in COC and what happens to that person a few years down the line. The story is set in the same world, but is not the further adventures of one particular person (unlike the Vorkosigan Saga).

The only thing I can note is that all three books are something like magical/mystical detective stories set against a background of political intrigue.

[duchess of malfi]

Agree with Zahir. While her science fiction series about the Vorkosigans is a definate series, the three fantasy books can be easily read as stand alones set in the same world.

A lot of people who are into hard-core science fiction (focusing on the ships, weapons, etc.) at one of my other boards do not like Bujold at all. But there are plenty who love her, with her focus on developing characters and their relationships (that would include friendship and family as much as romantic entanglements).

[Zahir]

Personally, I don't care much for gadgets and battles. But genuinely compelling characters...that is something else. Bujold is superb at creating those, and situations inherently exciting that brings those characters into sharp relief without degenerating into formula.

[taraswizard]

I'm reading Cordelia's Honor, and I got a few questions. Is Cordelia Naismith Lady Vorkosigan condemned from ever returning to Beta Colony, and she has no homesickness does that seem impropbable to anyone? So Cordelia and Aral just meet on the survey planet, trek the sixty or so miles back to the supply depot and now they're in love with each other, and is that a standard trope of romance fiction? Barrayar and Beta Colony speak the same language, seems not so probable? Does anyone think Bujold is a little to condemnatory to the decandence and corruption of Beta as compared to Barrayar?

[duchess of malfi]

I'm reading Cordelia's Honor, and I got a few questions. Is Cordelia Naismith Lady Vorkosigan condemned from ever returning to Beta Colony, and she has no homesickness does that seem impropbable to anyone? So Cordelia and Aral just meet on the survey planet, trek the sixty or so miles back to the supply depot and now they're in love with each other, and is that a standard trope of romance fiction? Barrayar and Beta Colony speak the same language, seems not so probable? Does anyone think Bujold is a little to condemnatory to the decandence and corruption of Beta as compared to Barrayar?

Spoiler

She usually stays with her husband, where ever he travels. I think that she could probably go there if she wishes to. She and Aral's children certainly are free to go then whenever they have the desire or chance to.

She certainly thinks that some Betan ways are better than some Barrayan ways (and vice versa). She sends the children of friends there for their educations in later books.

She certainly comes to think that Betan ways of reproduction and of dealing with sex are far batter than the Barrayaran equivelents.

I've always been under the impression that until fairly recently, most people on Barrayar did not speak Galactic, as the people on Beta and Escobar and more civilized worlds do. Barrayar settlement population was primarily Russian, with French and Greek minorities. I have always been under the impression that until the Cetagandan invasion, modified forms of those languages were spoken there, with an emphasis on the Russian.

In this universe, Beta is left wing American politics run amok. Barrayar is right wing military politics run amok. Bujold finds things to scewer and to admire about both.

[taraswizard]

NOBODY TOLD ME!

Warrior's Aprrentice (the text that follows Barrayar in the saga of Miles Naismith Vorkosigan, who we just catch a glimpse of as a little five yr. old right at the end of Barrayar) is not available anymore as a stand alone volume. We now have Young Miles, which is a fixup of Warrior's Apprentice, The Vor Game and The Mountains of Mourning. And now one can say I'm Bujoldaholic.

spoiler:

Spoiler

So I read an Amazon review and they let out a huge spoiler about a big death at the begining of WA, and though not mentioning by name I figured out it's the girl Elena Bothari.

Well I've heard some readers have brought Bujold to task over this and really given heer tons of grief over this plot circumstance.

[duchess of malfi]

Mountains of Mourning is one of the finest stories/novellas I have ever read by any author. Period. It sums up the entire character of Miles Vorkosigan, as well as the struggle faced by the entire world of Barrayar when past and present collide. It's beautiful, just beautiful!

[Zahir]

Duchess, totally agree. And of course the events of that story directly figure into the plot of the novel Memory ("Miles hits thirty. Thirty hits back.")

[duchess of malfi]

Have any of you guys read her new book yet? The Sharing Knife: Beguilement is a fantasy set in a new and very interesting world. Adventure, romance, the most interesting use of necromancy I have ever run into.

I really loved it.

[Zahir]

My finances are such that I can't really afford any new (or even used) books until sometime in the new year.

[duchess of malfi]

Well, this one is the first half of what is said will be a duology. The second half is not out yet. So maybe if you wait, you will eventually be able to read both books at once, rather than being stuck waiting and yearning for answers like I will.

[taraswizard]

Mountains of Mourning, finished it earlier this evening. What an incredibly sad, sad story! In the fixup Young Miles, it is placed physically between WA and VG. It wiped me out physically and do not think I'll be reading anything for at least a day or so.

Duchess, I'm quite sure I do not agree about your parallel comparison for Betan society. Certainly, not based on Shards of Honor; IMO, based on the descriptions of SoH the dominant impression one gets regarding Beta Colony is decadence, vulgarity and corruption. Now reading Warrior's Apprentice, one gets a more balanced view of Beta but I do not think it fits into the parallel you're trying to make.

[duchess of malfi]

Sure - Beta is filled with corruption, vulgarity, etc. No question what so ever about that. None at all. Just as Barrayar is filled with near worship for the military, extremely conservative people, and violence. But just as Barrayar is a lot more than that brief description, so is Beta.

Beta values freedom of press and expression in the arts (even if those journalists are slime balls who would put our papparazi to shame and those arts are sometimes or maybe even often pron). Beta is one of the research engines for the galaxy and values education immensely (a Betan education is highly valued everywhere in the galaxy and rich people from other planets send their bright youngsters there). Betans value free speech and is the one example of something like a democracy that I can remember in that galaxy - or at least among the planets we get to spend a decent bit of time on. Betans do not hestitate to go to therapy and other such things to work out their problems, including sexual ones. While Beta is vulgar, on the other hand they do not have huge hang ups on sexuality and birth control and homosexuality and other such issues like you see on Barrayar and other places. Beta is highly advanced in the medical arts and things widely practiced there have not even made it to places like Barrayar yet. On the other hand, the government on Beta can be like a nanny, or big sister or brother, watching over the populace. Such as in the issue of children, as in highly controlling the reproductive rights of its citizens. Go ahead and enjoy sex. But you will use birth control. Because you cannot have kids unless you pass a certain tight criteria. The average Betan seems to have a lot more rights and wealth and education than the average person on Barrayar - especially in the case of women. There is no true underclass or poverty class on Beta.

You get to see Beta in a much more positive light when Lord Mark enters the story and becomes a major character in his own right later on, in the time of Mirror Dance (which might be her best novel, but is every bit as exhausting as Mountains of Mourning) and thereafter in the series.

These are some of the reasons I call Beta American left politics/culture taken to an extreme and parodied, just as Barrayar sometimes seems like American right politics/culture taken to an extreme and parodied. But both cultures are also themselves. While Beta has some elements of blue state culture and Barrayar has some elements of red state culture, they are both their own places when all is said and done.

If you really want to see a weird culture in that galaxy, wait until you get to Cetaganda. Both Beta and Barrayar, while having very different cultures from each other, are both still recognizably human. Cetaganda is rather questionable in that regard.

[taraswizard]

My friend, Maureen, in California is a huge Bujold fan. In her opinion, Mountains of Mourning is the distilled expression of Barrayaran culture and society. IOW, if you understand the story and its conflicts and resolutions, then one will understand Barrayar.

[duchess of malfi]

My friend, Maureen, in California is a huge Bujold fan. In her opinion, Mountains of Mourning is the distilled expression of Barrayaran culture and society. IOW, if you understand the story and its conflicts and resolutions, then one will understand Barrayar.

I would absolutely and completely agree with that.

I would also say that is the distillation of the character of Miles Vorkosigan. This little novella shows exactly who Miles is, and who he wishes to be.

[taraswizard]

Bujold's books seem to get their fair share of Amazon reviews. I do not care much about the actual reviews in Amazon; FWIW, I think I know what's better than average and I definitely know what I like and LMB passes both those criteria. However, it does interest me that Bujold seems to get some extremely negative comments and quality judgements that are not subjective, 'this is not really science fiction'. IOW, one my interests in those reviews are their extreme negativity.