A post to Mr. Donaldson in his "Gradual Interview"

[ur-bane]

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You are assuming the parallel existence of multiple timelines. I am not, and I don't think SRD is either. I contend that when Linden arrived in the Land, the Staff was missing because she was present 3000 years before to remove it via the caesure. And she was present because she rode the caesure back into the past.

I see no evidence at all that SRD deals in the idea of multiple timelines. Everything in Runes can be explained with a single timeline, and unless something different turns up, Occam's Razor demands that we stick with that.
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I am not only assuming the parallel existence of multiple timelines. Certainly, they are a possibilty in a world in which timetravel itself is possibility. But they are not the only possibility.

By SRD's own definition of The Law of Time in his world, given to us by Esmer while explaining the caesures:

"Within them'" he explained,"the Law of Time, which requires that events trans-
pire in sequence, and that one action must lead to another, is severed. Within them,
every moment which has ever passed in their ambit as they move exists at once."

time is a series of consecutive moments, with each moment "leading" to the next.
By this very definition, it is possible to go into the past without altering it.

For example, consider each moment is a baseball. They are all neatly arranged in a line, and all numbered, oh 1 to 3000, say. Baseball 1 is the moment the Waynhim have the Staff. Linden goes back in time (along the line of baseballs) and ends up at baseball number 1. Now what she is doing is putting more baseballs in the line. So now, the line becomes 1, 1Linden, 2Linden, 3Linden, 4Linden...10Linden(the baseball where she leaves with the Staff),2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9....3000.

Linden inserted baseballs (moments) into the line, and now those baseballs "pushed forward" all the other baseballs, but their order remains intact.
Now, based on the definition, the last moment of Linden in the past needs to generate another moment (baseball) in the line. one action must lead to another. And each of those new moments (baseballs) simply "pushes forward" all the other moments (baseballs) that already existed.

Because she used a caesure which severed the Law, the above scenario is a possibility that completely follows with SRD's Law of Time. The timeline is still intact, it is now just becoming longer. And Linden's inserted moment 1Linden can never catch up to moment 3000, therefore the present of the Land she entered will not be altered by the past into which she traveled. The alteration occurs when she returns, and not sooner.

**So in the image I inserted above, the purple line would be drawn to the left of the red line, immediately to the right of the first red moment, pushing the red line ever to the right.**

I don't subscribe to the conventional "theory" that someone from the present can go into the past to alter the present from which they came, regardless of what Bill and Ted say.
Someone came up with that idea, and it stuck. But what I described above is the way I view it. Because an act cannot be undone. Therefore it would still have occured along any timeline, and therefore also would it not affect the present to which a timetraveler returns.
That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

[Softheart Fistfollower]

It seems to me that SRD kept the timeline completely singular. I don't beleive that moments of time were added or moved but simply existed the same way allways. In other words the Staff wasn't missing it was simply taken from one moment to the next. The Ranyhyn see time this way which is why they always appear immediately when summoned. They 'hear' the summons long before it actually happens. So it appeared that the Staff was missing to Linden and everyone else simply because it was brought to the present. There was only the one timeline where the staff wasn't present for the 3000 years.

[Variol Farseer]

It seems to me that SRD kept the timeline completely singular. I don't beleive that moments of time were added or moved but simply existed the same way allways.

This is certainly the simplest explanation, and I don't see anything in the story that requires a more complicated one.

If true, it means that Linden goofed on a cosmic scale — which I think some people would rather not believe. Frankly, I'd rather believe that she did cause the problem she was trying to solve. It's almost a law of nature that the hero(ine) of any long tale by SRD does everything wrong in the first book of the series. Why should Linden get a free pass?

We'll find out more in Fatal Revenant, of course. Until then I'll stick with the simple explanation.

[ur-bane]

So I guess what you mean is that Linden will have some kind of revelation:
"Oh my God! It was me all along! I've been helping Foul for 3000 years."

It seems to me that SRD kept the timeline completely singular. I don't beleive that moments of time were added or moved but simply existed the same way allways.

So then what you are saying is that all time is already written in the Land. In which case anything going on in the present does not matter, because its outcome is already predetermined.

I don't buy it. Linden gave the staff to Sunder and Hollian, and then was in the Land no more until 3000 years later. The moment of her removing it did not always exist.
But, as you say, VF, we should find out more in FR. SRD is ultimately the only person who knows exactly how time works in his world. But I for one think the explanation will not be simple. And if we're all still here in 10 years, perhaps the explanation itself will be cause for debate.

Oh, and one other thing. @VF: Just so I am clear, I enjoy this conversation. Right or wrong on my part is not important. I enjoy spinning the wheels of my mind. Even if those wheels tend to take me down a different road.

[CovenantJr]

I contend that when Linden arrived in the Land, the Staff was missing because she was present 3000 years before to remove it via the caesure. And she was present because she rode the caesure back into the past.

I agree.

It doesn't matter whether it was moved, lost, or destroyed: any of those things would prevent it from being used to defend the Earthpower.

I disagree. The Staff was lost - no-one knew where it was. The Staff was gone - it didn't exist in the world at that time. Not the same thing.

[Softheart Fistfollower]

It seems to me that SRD kept the timeline completely singular. I don't beleive that moments of time were added or moved but simply existed the same way allways.

So then what you are saying is that all time is already written in the Land. In which case anything going on in the present does not matter, because its outcome is already predetermined.

I don't buy it. Linden gave the staff to Sunder and Hollian, and then was in the Land no more until 3000 years later. The moment of her removing it did not always exist.

Well if you believe the Staff had been in the Land for the 3000 years until Linden went back in time to retrieve it, do you think that Kevins Dirt could have existed? That its influence or the Elohim(with the staff) would have prevented it?

[ur-bane]

Actually I do. The Staff of Law was present when Drool maligned the moon.
The staff enabled Drool to deform animals. The Earthpower itself which the Staff upholds enabled the Despiser's return from Desecration.
The Staff in Elena's hands was present when she broke one of the very Laws the Staff upholds: The Law of Death.

Sure, this is a new Staff of Law given life by Findail and Vain, and with the knowledge of healing Linden possessed she added the final piece of the puzzle. Although this new Staff was considered "alive" in a sense, it still could not act on its own. It may influence the areas in which it is kept, and the Law may be stronger there, but the Staff in itself would not deter the presence of Kevin's Dirt.

I think the Dirt may be connected to Linden, however, since she was ultimately responsible for the way the new Staff interacts with the world.
Was she truly over her blackness? Did she ever forgive herself for Ceer?
Could one or two "impure thoughts" have found its way into the Staff at the time she gave it Life? I think perhaps yes.
And it is also a possibility that Linden herself enabled and/or created the Dirt because of who she was when she renewed the Land and Law. And that does not require time travel to hold true. Anything and everything that happened over the 3000 years does not require the absence of the staff.
Don't forget...Law is not the opposite of Despite, just as Earthpower is not the answer to Despite. Law can be manipulated by Despite. But Law cannot defend itself. It needs help. The Staff alone and unused is not help enough.

As far as the Elohim are concerned, do you honestly think that the "people" they have become would deliberately embark on a mission to use the Staff to save the world? To Appoint one of their own unprovoked?

The Sunbane itself was not enough to make them act. Had Covenant not possessed the White Gold at the time, Findail would not have even been Appointed. The white Gold in Linden's hands was their salvation. They did not wish to sacrifice anything at all themselves to save the Earth.
If it were the White Ring that was lost, then certainly they would jump at the opportunity.
Plus, why would the Elohim need the Staff at all? They are Earthpower incarnate. In their arrogance they don't even know they are powerless against Despite, and they also feel untouchable by Despite. Life outside their clachan need not even exist to those b$st@rds.