Aliens - Do they exist?

[Revan]

Do you think that aliens do exist? Or that any creatures have ever visited earth from other planets...

I think that we are not alone in this universe, we can't be the only life forms in existence. That's pretty much impossible. So there has to be life out there somewhere, do you think that there is? Or that any have visited Earth. i mean I used to watch loads of documentries concerning this; they interested me greatly, and I'd say that it doesn't sound as completely farfetched as this post is probably sounding. But that doesn't mean I believe. I wouldn't believe until put infront of an alien creature face to face.

What do you think? Have you heard stories, newws reports that could add to this discussion.

[Loredoctor]

I think that we are not alone in this universe, we can't be the only life forms in existence. That's pretty much impossible. So there has to be life out there somewhere,

I'm not sure if I can agree with that logic. I can accept microbial life, even up to complex creatures, but as for intelligent life - well I have strong doubts. The odds for intelligence developing is extremely unlikely, and just because there are lots of stars it does not mean there are lots of habitable worlds.

[Revan]

Very true, as logic would certainly suggest; but I am not willing to overlook the possibility that there could be intelligent life out there.

[Loredoctor]

Well said. I would love for there to be intelligent life, but if there are, where are they? Were are the signs? I read an interesting article that we shouldnt be listening for messages - we should be looking. Objects the size of brown dwarfs that have high reflectivity - artificial objects that tell us here is intelligence.

[danlo]

The odds for intelligence developing is extremely unlikely

Nothing against you my friend but when anyone ever says that around me I find it extremely egocentic--then again I never was much for logic I think (and I use that word advisedly) that there are other intelligent lifeforms out there: they're simply too intelligent to be bothered by our violent, petty ways.

[Avatar]

Interesting. Like Darth, I'm open to the possibility, but I agree the chances are astronomical.

That said, it's pretty astronomically unlikely that we're here in the first place, and if we accept that intelligence evolved on earth, there is absolutely no reason that it couldn't do so elsewhere.

While there may be few planets inhabitable by us, that's not to say that other life hasn't evolved along very divergent lines. Nor do I take the lack of evidence at the moment to be a particularly conclusive argument.

The universe is HUGE. Hell, our galaxy is huge, and it's only one of hundreds of thousands, if not millions.

Another question, of course, is about the "infinity" of the universe. If it is infinite, (spatially at least), then the chances are much better. "In an infinite universe, anything concieveable is possible." Right? Even if there's only a .0000000001 to the millionth chance, that possibility must exist if the universe is limitless.

Whether we'll ever know, whether we'll ever encounter another intelligent life-form, I'm not sure. But if intelligence arose (however slowly) from uni-celled organisms, then it must be possible for it to rise from organisms elsewhere eventually. Even if we discover microbial life today, whose to say that in 100 million years, it wouldn't be intelligent? (If we didn't interfere that is. )

--A

[aTOMiC]

The fact that it is impossible to prove we are alone in the universe gives the idea some merit. Until we can inspect every galaxy that is hurtling though space I don't think anyone can believe anything but gut feelings and if by some miracle we are able to detect something local and tangible within range of our abilities (which are pretty meager considering the entirety of the Milky Way) then wahoo.

[Loredoctor]

The odds for intelligence developing is extremely unlikely

Nothing against you my friend but when anyone ever says that around me I find it extremely egocentic--then again I never was much for logic I think (and I use that word advisedly) that there are other intelligent lifeforms out there: they're simply too intelligent to be bothered by our violent, petty ways.

No problem.
My issue with intelligent life is this (using the Drake-Sagan Equation[approximate]):

%life-supporting stars + %planets in safe orbit + %life-supporting planets + %Time for life to evolve without being eradicated by asteroids + %intelligence to evolve + . . . .
Now, the fault lies between the latter two. It basically asks for an assumption that given time we will have intelligent life. But soooo many other factors need be present (obviously) for it happen. AND as I said in a post last year, all these odds don't mean that with 10 trillion worlds a % will turn up with intelligent life; it would like rolling a million dice and expecting all 6s to show up BUT that a third of the dice must rely upon the 6s turning up on other dice (interrelated factors of evolution). The odds are that remote that so many iterations (planets) do not guarantee intelligent life.
Again, where are they now? Where are the probes, the giant objects, the signals?

[wayfriend]

Do you think that aliens do exist?

Oh, we exist. Shh.

[danlo]

it would be like rolling a million dice

to butcher an Einstien quote: God doesn't roll dice!

[Loredoctor]

it would be like rolling a million dice

to butcher an Einstien quote: God doesn't roll dice!

LOL!

He does in Dungeons & Dragons!

[ur-bane]

...Again, where are they now? Where are the probes, the giant objects, the signals?

I am going to give a thought that I mentioned in a discussion in the Close....

Turn that around. Maybe somewhere else in the universe this exact type of discussion is going on. With the vastness of space and the time it takes to get anywhere, and given the fact that what we see today is not what exists now in the far reaches of our universe, isn't it possible that even if intelligent life does exist elsewhere we will never know?

Look at it this way: We are searching the past when we search into space, as would somebody on the other side of the universe who might be looking our way. So....they're 4 billion light years away.....they happen across our solar system and theorize that based on their knowledge the 3rd planet may be a life-supporting planet.
From our point of view, we're intelligent life now. But they would see a planet in its infancy.

So, even if it's out there, unless it evolved well before us, and within reasonable closeness to us, I don't think we'll ever meet or find evidence of intelligent life other than ourselves.

[Loredoctor]

Good points, but that's assuming life everywhere arose at the same time. There may be life that started long ago. If life is prelevant, intelligent life, we can assume that some would have evolved long before us (not too long ago, as heavier elements like carbon was not around much in the early time of the cosmos).

A civilisation that evolved well before, and survived war, would probably send out replicating probes, construct vast artifacts, send out powerful signals, even attempt near C travel. That we haven't seen any of that suggests there is no other intelligent life.

[Edge]

Personally, I'm still not convinced of intelligent life on this planet.

[ur-bane]

That we haven't seen any of that suggests there is no other intelligent life.

I think you need to add the "that started long ago" that you had in your 2nd sentence to the end of that sentence.

Perhaps we are the most advanced form of intelligence in the universe. So perhaps NOBODY will venture into space across light years before we do. (This is not an arrogant stance...just one possibility.)

Sure, Aliens and visits from other-world beings to my mind are bogus...but I still think there's [intelligent] life out there. Heck, maybe they're so smart that they realize they had better stay the h*ll away from us.

Personally, I'm still not convinced of intelligent life on this planet.

I'm with you on that, Edge...sentience doesn't necessarily equivocate to intelligence.

[Loredoctor]

Personally, I'm still not convinced of intelligent life on this planet.

Well said.

Ur-Bane - I think it basically comes to how we regard the odds. I would love for there to be intelligent/sentient life, but I think it is so unlikely.

[ur-bane]

I can agree on that, Loremaster. It is indeed a POV thing. (I don't think we'll be able to proveone way or the other, so for now, you can be the only intelligent life, but I'll live thinking that I'm not the only intelligent life. )

[Loredoctor]

I am indeed comfortable believing that I am the only intelligent life in the universe. That, and dashing, charismatic and modest!

[danlo]

I once thought that the whole world revolved around me, but I came thiiiiis close to burning myself to a crisp!

[Cheval]

If there was other life-forms out there, what makes you humans think that
you'd would even be able to recognize that is IS life? (Intelligent or not)

Maybe it is a liquid or gasous form (and not as you Earthlings know it as those forms)
Or maybe an engery form?
If it was capable of near-light speed (without being light form), it wouldn't be visible, would it?
Or so small that it is microscopic size. See THAT through a telescope!
(We're being invaded by the millions now and can't see it!!!
Run for the hills!!!)
maybe the aliens are so-o-o large, that they are the ones who are
viewing US under one of those super-powered microscopes.
Talk about a "view from above"!

But then again, what do I know?
(And I agree with what Edge stated on the previous page.)