A Dark and Crappy Book Arises

[kevinswatch]

Well, it looks like our worst fears have finally come true. Book 11 of The Wheel of Time has been released. I saw copies of it stacked in my university book store yesterday.

The good news, is that I was able to fight the temptation to buy the stupid thing.

Oh, it was hard. It kept calling to me.

Jay...

Jaaay...

It's me! The Wheel of Time!

Me: Stay back, Wheel of Time! I know karate!

I promise that I won't suck this time.

Me: You promised that last time, Wheel of Time! And you sucked!

Put down that stupid book by that hack Stephen R. Donaldson... Come and read the great fantasy epic by the great Robert Jordan... You know you want to...

Me: Tempt me not, satan! I'm trying to read a book that doesn't suck for a change!

You know you will read it sooner or later anyway. I own your soul. You might as well just give up now and read me... Come Jay... Read about all of your favorite Wheel of Time characters as they talk about pointless dribble and accomplish nothing over the course of six hundred pages... You know you love it... Embrace me... Read me... Give into your inner desire... Jay... Jaaay...

Me: No! NOOOOOOO!!! It's not true! I don't believe you! AHHHHHHH!!!

At that point I knocked over the entire bookshelf, kicked over a display, and ran out of the store screaming.

I'm scared. I think The Wheel of Time knows where I live... I can't escape it...-jay

[Alynna Lis Eachann]

On this score, I'm like Picard... I was sucked into the crazy, but through luck, inner strength and outside aid was able to free myself.

The Wheel tempts me not.

[Revan]

ROFLMAO!!!!!

Jay, that had me laughing my head off!

Anyways, I've read the book... it isn't actually that bad.

*Ignores the shock and screams of protest around him*

the story, believe it or not, actually moves in a direction. And there isn't that much crap in there; I assume because Jordan had to move the story on too much for him to bother with the usual crap.

Egwene, Nyneave aren't as much as an arrogant pair of bitches as she usually is; or rather, she is, but we don't get our faces rammed into their pile of crap.

Tuon and Min remain, as ever, my favourite female characters.

I actually felt sorry for the fate of a certain bad character in this book. Regardless how much that person has done wrong, I don't think anyone should have ended the way this person does.

The one factor that I am truly angry about is (BIG SPOILERS)

Spoiler

Taim.
Robert Jordan had a perfect chance to create a truly "grey" charcater, But he completely blew it. By making Taim a Darkfriend. And the fact that he is a Darkfriend does not explain for a lot of his actions. Such as recusing Rand from the Aes Sedai in book 6... stupid.

So read it Jay... be honest... you know you will sooner or later... it's calling to you Jay... and you cannot resist... You are drawn to it as a fat person is drawn to burgers... come jay... read it...

[duchess of malfi]

Be strong Jay, be strong.

And since this one is the second to last book, why not hold out until the last one comes out, and you can finish the whole thing (last two books) in one long reading orgy?

[Avatar]

Hey, it wasn't that bad. (Some) storylines got (mostly) resolved, not many new ones opened, things actually happened.

Hell, compared to the last 2/3 books, this one seemed almost too fast. Book 12 is still going to have to be a huge one to wrap it all up, but this is the best one in a long time.

Darth,

Spoiler

Darkfriend? Surely he's one of the Forsaken? Who else uses that phrase?

Read it Jay... (But finish Runes first. )

--A

[Revan]

Avatar

Spoiler

No he isn't... he might be a new Forsaken though; but he is not one of the thirteen Forsaken that awoke... I think he might be Demandred's man... I recall Sammael saying, "Demandred always liked using proxy's

Yet this is not patent with what we know of the Forsaken and their alliances... we all know that Demandred, Semirhage, Mesaana (sp?) are working together... and in book six Rand was on his way to the White Tower... where Mesaana is located... so if Taim is Demandred's man, he wouldn't mind Masaana having Rand.... it makes no sense... once again Jordan has given us a character whose personality and goals belie their actions.

[Avatar]

Spoiler

Hmm, maybe one of the new ones...good point about the old ones though...Taim has been around a long while, unless this is an imposter.

--A

[Alynna Lis Eachann]

So, do we finally find out who killed Asmodean?

[duchess of malfi]

From the spoilers I have seen over at the Martin board, it doesn't sound like it.

However, everyone has been saying that he does get back on track with this one. He kills off lots of minor characters and resolves a bunch of neverending stuff that's been carried over from book to book to book to book... A lot of them are actually saying its a little too fast paced in places!

[Avatar]

Hell, compared to the last 2/3 books, this one seemed almost too fast.

--A

[[Syl]]

Finished it. Not quite as good as Winter's Heart, definately not as good as the first 4, but it's pretty good. There's still a bit of crap, but it's mostly in the third quarter (starts rambling about dresses again). Heck, it actually made me like Egwene again. Blessedly little from Faile and Nyn's POV. Aviendha's barely in the book, though she exits the stage just when she starts to get interesting. Unfortunately, Min's starting to take act too much like the others. Elayne is slightly less annoying (but still too stupid to be queen, imo), but the goatsmilk thing is getting as bad as the sniffing. Mat, of course, is where the book's at.

Spoiler

Would've liked a bit more on Galad after the prologue. The bit with Semirhage was anticlimactic, though Rand losing his hand and how he dealt with it were pretty cool (I don't see him relearning the sword before T'armon Gaidon. much more likely to create a hand ala Luke Skywalker using Saidin). Glad the Dragon Spear got blasted. Always thought it was dumb. Where's Gawayn again? Aram disappointed me (and in the Donaldsonian sense, I think Jordan disappointed Aram). Would've rather seen Masema bite it. I really wish we could see more on the Ogier fighting (either the ones in the Deathwatch Guard or Loial and them). And the Tower of Genji better not get short shift in the next book.

[duchess of malfi]

I'm about halfway through. I started reading it when I got too frustrated over my NaNoWriMo story yesterday afternoon. I put it down when I hit my first Elayne chapter.

So far its...OK. The Mat and Tuon chapters are a lot of fun, and there have been a lot of those so far. The Egwene parts have been interesting! I don't know how long its been since I have enjoyed any Egwene parts. The Faile parts are boring, but it does look like those might actually get resolved somewhere in this book. The Faile storyline has gone on for waaaaaaaay too long now.

Jordan seems to have gotten away from the braid tugging and sniffing, thank God. Lots of women spanking women, though -- what's up with that?

Spoiler

Though I loved it when Mat spanked that snotty Aes Sedai!!!

I can see why people are saying its too fast paced. A major event takes place comepletely off stage. How come Jordan can spend ten pages describing clothes in some of these books and then gives a brief report about

Spoiler

the mass murder of an entire ruling family except for one member by one of the Forsaken in a couple of paragraphs??

edited: Its worth reading through all of those hundreds of pages of dresses and spankings in previous books to get to a great chapter like

Spoiler

The Golden Crane

. Every now and then Jordan can write a scene as good as anything out there by anyone. I actually got tears in my eyes!

Spoiler

And this chapter redeems Nynaeve, with her obvious great love for her husband, as a character once and for all. The Golden Crane flies to Tarmon Gaimon!!

[Avatar]

Good post Duchess. Yeah, there's usually a few moments that catch in the throat. He can do it when he tries.

--A

[duchess of malfi]

I've got to wonder if he was as bored writing the Faile and Elayne storylines as I am when I read them. But his writing really comes alive in the Rand and Mat chapters -- and that one fantastic Nynaeve chapter.

I have about fifty or so pages to go, but it looks as if the

Spoiler

Faile kidnapping

and the

Spoiler

Elayne trying to become Queen

storylines either have been or will be wrapped up in this book. The

Spoiler

Egwene

storyline, also. If anything is left hanging in any of those three plotlines, they can probably be resolved very quickly in the next book.

So far:

Great Things:

Spoiler

golden crane

Good Things:

Spoiler

Mat and Tuon chapters
The big battle with the trollocs, though that was over too quickly
the Rand and the Forsaken battle chapter, though that was also over too quickly
Rand's madness, his alternate personality actually taking him over at point!
lots of Logain - I have always liked him
the Egwene chapters are actually pretty good!
all of the weirdness and strangeness with the world starting to become unravelled and the final battle coming soon

The Bad and the Ugly:

Spoiler

still way too much of Faile and Elayne - those two plotlines have dragged on way too long now
how lame the bad guys still are -- the trolloc battle was cool in a way, but it would have been a lot cooler if the trollocs seemed like more of a threat!

How Can He Fit All of This One Book:

Spoiler

Avi finds a new talent, just as she is taken away by the Wise Ones -- hopefully there will be a reason for both of those things

Obviously he will be bringing together the White Tower factions and the "good guys" part of the Black Tower before the final battle -- which means he will have to split the Black Tower, and get the White Tower together somehow even with all of those snotty women and their neverending jockeying for power and position.

So many hints of "high tech" being developed -- repeater crossbows, cannons, steam powered wagons pulling what sounds to be trains on roads -- hopefully he is going somewhere with those.

The whole Rand storyline seemed rushed in this book, but there is a lot going on. It'll be interesting to see how he gets to the Last Battle with enough body parts and sanity (not to mention life) left to fight it.

Mat and Thom and an unknown person must rescue a certain missing Aes Sedai, and Mat must face his Snakes and Foxes...this has the potential to be a major story line, and I wish Jordan could have written about it rather than the endless quest for Andor's throne, which has been going on for how many books now?

And, of course, he has begun hinting that all of the forces of the good guys are starting to come together or at least getting ready for the Last Battle. That's going to be the big payoff for wading through all of the descriptions of dresses, braid tugging, sniffing, and spankings. It had better be good, dang it!

[Avatar]

Yeah, I'm really looking forward to the

Spoiler

Snakes and Foxes, and the tower of Genji story-line. Too long in the coming too.

And I think that the

Spoiler

Seanchan story-line could do with a lot of building too...lot's of potential

In fact, I really think this series could be served by another 2 or 3 books, unless the last one is really massive. It'll seem like such a waste to have dragged through 7-10, and then rushed to cram everything into the last one. It's like he struggles to find a balance.

Some of those story-lines though, I'm glad are done with...and some I'll miss...(Not the myriad of minor characters though.)

Yeah, thinking about it, it needs another two or three to do it justice.

--A

[theDespiser]

i bought it, all they had was a huge hardback...DAMMIT...i was used to getting them all in paperback...i also picked up a game of Kings, by Martin..im currently reading that, so, after i finish those...(how many are in the series? is it actually done yet, or did i stumble on another damn series that wont be done for another 6 years?) i think ill read knife of dreams...THEN...after that, ill have time to read the first 2 Chrons again, and then...FINALLY...no, wait, by that time the last harry potter might be out...and then...FINALLY...RUNES OF THE EARTH...i got it when it came out, but had to keep it hidden so i didnt read it till i re-read the first two chrons....

[I'm Murrin]

i also picked up a game of Kings, by Martin..im currently reading that, so, after i finish those...(how many are in the series? is it actually done yet, or did i stumble on another damn series that wont be done for another 6 years?)

Four books are out, and three forthcoming. He released the first three pretty consistently, but then got bogged down on the fourth (wrote half of a book, changed his mind and scrapped it, started over on the book that just came out, which seems to have been a difficult job for him) and took five years. Book five could be out late next year, because he was half-done when book four went to print. After that, he's back on track, so should probably get back on schedule for two more books to conclude the series.
The series is:
A Game of Thrones
A Clash of Kings
A Storm of Swords
A Feast for Crows
A Dance with Dragons (forthcoming, possibly next year)
The Winds of Winter (forthcoming)
A Dream of Spring (forthcoming)

So, I'd guess.... five years from now? Doesn't quite make that six years you mentioned.

[Loredoctor]

Well, it looks like our worst fears have finally come true. Book 11 of The Wheel of Time has been released. I saw copies of it stacked in my university book store yesterday.

The good news, is that I was able to fight the temptation to buy the stupid thing.

Oh, it was hard. It kept calling to me.

Jay...

Jaaay...

It's me! The Wheel of Time!

Me: Stay back, Wheel of Time! I know karate!

I promise that I won't suck this time.

Me: You promised that last time, Wheel of Time! And you sucked!

Put down that stupid book by that hack Stephen R. Donaldson... Come and read the great fantasy epic by the great Robert Jordan... You know you want to...

Me: Tempt me not, satan! I'm trying to read a book that doesn't suck for a change!

You know you will read it sooner or later anyway. I own your soul. You might as well just give up now and read me... Come Jay... Read about all of your favorite Wheel of Time characters as they talk about pointless dribble and accomplish nothing over the course of six hundred pages... You know you love it... Embrace me... Read me... Give into your inner desire... Jay... Jaaay...

Me: No! NOOOOOOO!!! It's not true! I don't believe you! AHHHHHHH!!!

At that point I knocked over the entire bookshelf, kicked over a display, and ran out of the store screaming.

I'm scared. I think The Wheel of Time knows where I live... I can't escape it...-jay

[Xar]

Spoiler

The whole Rand storyline seemed rushed in this book, but there is a lot going on. It'll be interesting to see how he gets to the Last Battle with enough body parts and sanity (not to mention life) left to fight it.

Heh, so true!

[Avatar]

Having just read Bk 11 again, I must agree that it seems dreadfully rushed. The whole series could have been great if he paced himself, but it's like he dragged himself through books 7-10, and then suddenly realised he was running out of books, and went into overdrive.

11 has some great scenes, especially with the Seanchan and Mat of course, but then I guess that scenes have always been his strong point. It's just books that cause problems for him.

--A