Yes, I know, this should be in Flicks. However this movie's emphasis on varying schools of existentialism, as well as it's deep mood and relative psychological extremes force me to make a topic of it here.
Is everything connected?
Is everything cruel, random chance?
Have you seen this movie? Even if you think "existentialism stinks" you will undoubtedly enjoy this movie!!!
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Haven't seen it myself, but I would just like to remark on Baradakas' comment by saying that just because it's random, it doesn't have to be cruel.
In fact, by definition, random can't be cruel, for the simple reason that "cruel" suggests purpose/motive/intent, and random excludes these factors.
Nature isn't "cruel", nature just is
And things can still be connected without discernable purpose.
--Avatar
In fact, by definition, random can't be cruel, for the simple reason that "cruel" suggests purpose/motive/intent, and random excludes these factors.
Nature isn't "cruel", nature just is
And things can still be connected without discernable purpose.
--Avatar
Interesting thought Av. Chance cannot be cruel, but Fate can?
"Fortunate circumstances do not equate to high ideals."
"Mostly muffins sir."- My answer in response to the question posed by the officer, "Son, do you have anything on you I should know about?"
His response: "Holy $&!^. He's not kidding! Look at all these muffins!"
"Mostly muffins sir."- My answer in response to the question posed by the officer, "Son, do you have anything on you I should know about?"
His response: "Holy $&!^. He's not kidding! Look at all these muffins!"
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Aah, a much tougher one. I don't think I really believe in "Fate" (although I waver sometimes 
).
I tend to prefer the thought that we are responsible for our actions, i.e. that nothing is predestined, or "going to happen no matter what". Perhaps things are intended to happen, but we certainly have the ability to alter the future through our actions.
I tend to think of "Fate" as a cop-out, an abrogation of responsibility: "It's not my fault, it was Fate". "There was nothing I could do, it was meant to happen".
I prefer thinking that I have at least some measure of control over what happens to me.
--Avatar
).I tend to prefer the thought that we are responsible for our actions, i.e. that nothing is predestined, or "going to happen no matter what". Perhaps things are intended to happen, but we certainly have the ability to alter the future through our actions.
I tend to think of "Fate" as a cop-out, an abrogation of responsibility: "It's not my fault, it was Fate". "There was nothing I could do, it was meant to happen".
I prefer thinking that I have at least some measure of control over what happens to me.
--Avatar
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Iryssa
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I'm gonna steal a quote from Donaldson to illustrate what I believe...
"A man may be fated to die, but no fate may determine if he will die in courage or in cowardice."
I think it was Mhoram who said that one (I love that guy...)
That's a bit of a simplistic snapshot of what I think about it anyway...in some ways, I think it's like a "choose your own adventure" book...but that's over-simplifying it too...I'll have to put my thoughts together a little more about this one before I can really get it typed, I guess...
"A man may be fated to die, but no fate may determine if he will die in courage or in cowardice."
I think it was Mhoram who said that one (I love that guy...)
That's a bit of a simplistic snapshot of what I think about it anyway...in some ways, I think it's like a "choose your own adventure" book...but that's over-simplifying it too...I'll have to put my thoughts together a little more about this one before I can really get it typed, I guess...
"A choice made freely is stronger than one compelled"
- Stephen R. Donaldson's The Wounded Land
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I sort of know what you're talking about though. Kind of "We're free to choose different paths to the same end."
I could go with that, but I don't really think that even the "End" is set in stone. The choices you make throughout your life effect what the final outcome will be.
If you like; Our "actions" determine our "Fate".
--Avatar
I could go with that, but I don't really think that even the "End" is set in stone. The choices you make throughout your life effect what the final outcome will be.
If you like; Our "actions" determine our "Fate".
--Avatar
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Iryssa
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Avatar wrote:I sort of know what you're talking about though. Kind of "We're free to choose different paths to the same end."
I could go with that, but I don't really think that even the "End" is set in stone. The choices you make throughout your life effect what the final outcome will be.
If you like; Our "actions" determine our "Fate".
--Avatar
Kinda... I'd agree that our end isn't necessarily determined, either...I think that certain "crossroads" of our lives are determined--there are certain major choices that we MUST make--and these crossroads will appear to us no matter what our path; the choice isn't made for us, it's just offered...I hope that makes sense...
"A choice made freely is stronger than one compelled"
- Stephen R. Donaldson's The Wounded Land
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Makes sense so far
But while there are definitely certain choices that MUST be made, and which, in a sense must be made regardless of the direction we choose, I think those probably tend to be milestones that everyone reaches.
I don't think (obviously) that an overall "plan" places those cross-roads for you. The choices you have to make still differ from person to person, and likely depend on the choices you've already made.
In other words, selecting a certain course alters the choices you will be faced with later. You won't be offered the same choices as you would have been, had you chosen another "path".
--A
But while there are definitely certain choices that MUST be made, and which, in a sense must be made regardless of the direction we choose, I think those probably tend to be milestones that everyone reaches.
I don't think (obviously) that an overall "plan" places those cross-roads for you. The choices you have to make still differ from person to person, and likely depend on the choices you've already made.
In other words, selecting a certain course alters the choices you will be faced with later. You won't be offered the same choices as you would have been, had you chosen another "path".
--A
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Fist and Faith
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I just saw this movie. I hadn't read this thread before, and had NO idea what it was about. A REALLY fun movie!! Funny, philosophical, excellent performances (particularly Dustin). I want to see it again, just to see if there's really anything to the philosophy. heh. All in all, sort of like a good episode of Northern Exposure.
All lies and jest
Still a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest -Paul Simon
Still a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest -Paul Simon
That's cruel! 
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Prebe
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I got fed up/incredibly annoyed with the hard to believe never ending sexual tension between the doctor guy and the semi good lookig short haired chick. Worse than Mulder and Scully. If they had just bunked in episode three and gotten over it, I would have enjoyed the series I think.
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I agree, Prebe. That kind of crap ruins plenty of shows, imo. Anything that was good about a show gets pushed to the background so they can put all their energy onto what is apparently the only thing that can keep our attention for any amount of time. Hill Street Blues is among the saddest casualities of that.
Although, I think NX was much, much more than the idiotic relationship between Joel and Maggie.
Although, I think NX was much, much more than the idiotic relationship between Joel and Maggie.
All lies and jest
Still a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest -Paul Simon
Still a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest -Paul Simon
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Prebe
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Glad you agree Fist. I was expecting an avalanche there 
But your observation is one that I never thought of: The stupid (disbelievable, heh) sexual tension is what keeps most people hooked. I only ever thought of it as a nuisance
Exnihilo: So the crappy part of the show is there to make the rest seem good? And the reason, that this difference makes up for perceived lack of quality, is that because beneath it all there is a current of conformity, the mere breakage of which, would bestow upon the viewer a sense of novelty?
(As this is a very ambitious sentence for a Dane please allow for a little leeway when reading)
But your observation is one that I never thought of: The stupid (disbelievable, heh) sexual tension is what keeps most people hooked. I only ever thought of it as a nuisance
Exnihilo: So the crappy part of the show is there to make the rest seem good? And the reason, that this difference makes up for perceived lack of quality, is that because beneath it all there is a current of conformity, the mere breakage of which, would bestow upon the viewer a sense of novelty?
(As this is a very ambitious sentence for a Dane please allow for a little leeway when reading
)"I would have gone to the thesaurus for a more erudite word."
-Hashi Lebwohl
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Anyway, I have a friend who thought it was a good show, but would be better if Chris wasn't on it. "He never shuts up!"