What Do You Think Today?

[Hashi Lebwohl]

I don;t think you can say that TV hasn't changed since 1958.

I haven't had a television set in about two years and really haven't watched much TV in the last five years so my analysis might be a little out of date.

[sgt.null]

first couple on tv to be in bed together?

the Brady parents.

[peter]

Lets be clear about this. To be anti-immigration is not to be a racist. No country in the world can be expected to take in large numbers of economic migrants and provide jobs for them at the expense of providing jobs for its indigenous population - and yet the media (certainly the UK media at least) insist on conflating the one with the other. Why do they do this? One can only assume that behind the scenes there are powers that benefit both from this deception and from the influx of cheap unregulated labour that unrestrained immigration delivers.

[Avatar]

Lets be clear about this. To be anti-immigration is not to be a racist. No country in the world can be expected to take in large numbers of economic migrants and provide jobs for them at the expense of providing jobs for its indigenous population - and yet the media (certainly the UK media at least) insist on conflating the one with the other. Why do they do this?

Although to be one is not necessarily to be the other, I don't think one can deny that one is often cover for the other. Or motivated by it. Obviously not in all cases, perhaps not even in most cases, but in many cases certainly.

--A

[I'm Murrin]

People seem to have difficulty talking about it without saying racist things.

[peter]

People seem to have difficulty talking about it without saying racist things.

Alas that is a reflection of the people rather than the issue. While I agree that in the past the anti-immigration arguments have provided a shield for mindless racism, I think in the current UK situation where some 25 % of 18 - 25y.o's languish at home never having worked, the very real problem of not having a reserve of 'take all' jobs at the base of the working spectrum is starting to hit home. In the absence of your work of choice any work is prefferable to none and the more so for the young who so need to get their feet on the ground at this early stage in thier post-education life. Only a fool would hold any ill-feeling toward those economic migrants who quite legally come to earn better wages than they could at home to give themselves that head start that they also need. But to state that the immigration policy of your countrymight be ill-suited to the times dose not qualify you to be labled as one of these numbskulls.

(On a lighter note, today I think that Debbie Harry in her prime was probably the best looking woman I have ever seen [alas when I saw her live she was 50, 18 stone and packed into a costume that Gwyneth Paltrow would have struggled to wear, but the fact remains]).

[Iolanthe]

Boston, Lincolnshire. A small town with a huge history.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-227219 ... peans.html

This says it all. But as part of the article says,

But I am also surprised by the lack of animosity. True, there is palpable anger among native Bostonians that their town has become a Baltic satellite in next to no time.

But it’s not an anger directed at the Eastern Europeans. It’s aimed squarely at the Government and the EU.

Lincolnshire’s vast flatlands have always needed people to pick and pack the vegetables and flowers which are the bedrock of the local economy.

Traditionally, the work was done by students and by part-time workers brought in from urban areas such as Doncaster and Nottingham.

But in 2004, Britain opened its doors to the new round of EU member nations, while, crucially, not implementing the labour restrictions imposed by other countries such as France and Germany. The result was an influx of large numbers from Poland, Latvia and Lithuania, happy to be paid wages and accept living conditions well below the local norm.

For their part, many locals found they could not compete with newcomers prepared to work longer hours while living in accommodation that verged on squalor.

As wage levels came down and local workers either moved elsewhere or fell back on the benefits system, so more and more migrants came in to fill the gaps.

[deer of the dawn]

Serves you right for eating a hotdog in a town that has some of the best restaurants in the world (:)). Next time you're there go for the buisiness lunch in Le Gavroche and learn the true meaning of ecstacy!

Yes, rather like getting fish and chips in NYC. If there's a restaurant called Le Gavroche, it has to be good!

[Linna Heartbooger]

In this instance, I will have to disagree--we really are still quite prudish when it comes to the subject of network television. For the most part, network TV still operates as if it were 1958, except that shows may televise a married couple lying in the same bad, the interior of a bathroom, and some slight cursing may occur.

Eh, I guess I was going more thinking about the question "why would someone care about limits on sexual images at all?" (but I decided to be vague! Hmm, that one is vague too.)
Not specifics of "what should or should not be on American television."
I've got the same problem as you with knowing specifics of what's on TV - no TV!

Ostensibly these rules are so that TV shows do not offend those with more sensitive tastes or display inappropriate images to children despite the fact that those children are probably watching cable shows or browsing the Internet where nothing is forbidden.

Sounds like you're annoyed that people don't bother to set limits on their own kids, maybe just wishing someone else would?

Contrary to my offline nature, which often finds me being quite the flirtatious scoundrel, I am not going anywhere near that statement.

Such decisions generally make me feel respected.

peter- well-stated argument; it's an issue I... don't actually think about a lot; wow, I can see why people would get more than a little upset, with good reason.

In the absence of your work of choice any work is prefferable to none and the more so for the young who so need to get their feet on the ground at this early stage in thier post-education life.

To diverge off from the main topic here a little...
Back when you were in their shoes, this assumption was firmly-held - and for good reason. (sanity!)
But I think a lot of young people... don't consciously realize that languishing at home without work is causing them so much grief.
Many of them think the problem is that they can't seem to get a good job within their chosen field; not the fact that they aren't working at all.
(Erm, at least that's the case with our culture here. Do you think that's the case where you are?)

Also, you reminded me of a story of someone encouraging me when I had a 'crummy' job right out of college.

[Hashi Lebwohl]

Sounds like you're annoyed that people don't bother to set limits on their own kids, maybe just wishing someone else would?

It does always annoy me when irresponsible parents let their little hellions do pretty much what they please. Those little hellions are going to grow up into big hellions and then they become a problem for everyone around them.

[peter]

Fully agree. In the shop I spend all day watching people let their small children run amok, pulling things from the shelves and running up and down the aisles shouting. Then there are the ones who shout continuousely from the other end of the shop, but never actually do anything to restrain the child - I feel like saying "For G's sake - the child is three years old. Hold it's hand or get some reins or something. It's you thats being foolish, not the child!"

[Damelon]

I ate the oddest hot dog in London. I bought it from a stand outside of the British Museum. It was rather phallic. They took a long thin baguette roll, where they had cut an end off and bored out a hole in it. They squirted mustard (they also offered ketchup, but I'm older than 5 and so don't eat ketchup with a hot dog) down the hole and inserted the hot dog. There was no mustard eating into it at first it was all at the end of the bun.

Serves you right for eating a hotdog in a town that has some of the best restaurants in the world (:)). Next time you're there go for the buisiness lunch in Le Gavroche and learn the true meaning of ecstacy!

Hey, it's what they had in front of their world class museum. . I'm sure Le Gavroche is good, but it also sounds like the kind of place where you need a platinum card.. I did find a good Italian restaurant near the hotel, and a good local pub. What more does one need.

[I'm Murrin]

Ah, I did see the hot dog vans outside the British Museum, but when I saw "baguette" on the menu I decided not to bother. Hot dogs belong in a bun, not a baguette.

[peter]

Yes - That Museum. Sometimes I daydream about getting a job as one of those guys who sit in the various galleries and direct people about etc. Talk about the perfect job.......

Ok - momentary failure of taste (gastronomic) forgiven in view of evidence of exellent taste (cultural) exhibited at later point .

[deer of the dawn]

To diverge off from the main topic here a little...
Back when you were in their shoes, this assumption was firmly-held - and for good reason. (sanity!)
But I think a lot of young people... don't consciously realize that languishing at home without work is causing them so much grief.
Many of them think the problem is that they can't seem to get a good job within their chosen field; not the fact that they aren't working at all.
(Erm, at least that's the case with our culture here. Do you think that's the case where you are?)

Honestly, if there are enough "take-all" jobs at the bottom of the pay scale to allow rafts of immigrants in to do them, why are those young people languishing at home, stinking up their parent's parlors and eating all the Doritos?

I didn't get out of college and assume I was going to slip into some high-class, high-pay job right off the bat. I did plenty of grunt work, washed me some dishes, cleaned me some toilets; some of that work was outside in the dead of a New England winter, and it was cold and wet in the wind and involved heavy lifting and climbing ladders.

I learned a lot about people, integrity, diligence, and what matters during those times.

I think people need to get back to the idea that to work at any honest labor is better than sitting around going stale.

[aliantha]

Well, granted. But typically, in America, a person holding any sort of college degree expects their first job to have *some* perks. For instance: indoors, sitting down, with more than rudimentary communication skills required, and with a minimum of physical exertion expected. In other words, a full-time office job with benefits.

That's assuming your major wasn't in some field like veterinary (heavy lifting) or teaching (lots of standing). My point is that a college degree ought to be a ticket out of low-wage and low-skilled jobs, not the entry level requirement for one. But that's what our economy is mostly providing for new grads right now.

[Vraith]

Well, granted. But typically, in America, a person holding any sort of college degree expects their first job to have *some* perks. For instance: indoors, sitting down, with more than rudimentary communication skills required, and with a minimum of physical exertion expected. In other words, a full-time office job with benefits.

That's assuming your major wasn't in some field like veterinary (heavy lifting) or teaching (lots of standing). My point is that a college degree ought to be a ticket out of low-wage and low-skilled jobs, not the entry level requirement for one. But that's what our economy is mostly providing for new grads right now.

It ought to be. Little tid-bit related to that, I spotted somewhere some research that put a big "Lie" or at least "Misleading" sign on the "people don't have the schools/education to fill the jobs" meme...
The brain power/skills required actually was highest back around 2000...it's significantly lower now.
[At least the McDonald's requiring bachelor's degree thing was false]

[peter]

But needs must when the devil drives. Yes ideally your college degree will pay off in the long run - but in the UK we have thousands of 'graduates' with 'degree's' in sport, film studies and rock music. Just how many sports coaches, film critics and DJ mixers do we need?

[deer of the dawn]

Then they need to get a "day job" to support their highly-qualified hobby.

[Hashi Lebwohl]

My degrees did not pay off because I would up in IT. Mathematics and Chemistry are now merely interests I pursue at my leisure rather than my working fields.