How Good Was Alexander the Great?

[peter]

Mary Beard in her book Confronting the Classics outlines how sketchy at best much of the evidence of Alexander the Great's prowess as a general is, and cites him as being more of a 'roman creation' in the way we now percieve him as conquerer of a large slice of the known world. She suggests [and is apparently not alone in the view] that had Alexander, instead of turning east into the Punjab [Ithink] turned his hand toward the emerging Roman forces, he would have been quickly 'trounced' and slotted back into a more limited place in history. Any thoughts on this.? {I'd always seen Alexander as the consumate military leader but apparently he was an inebriate sot leading a rag tag bunch of murderers and cut throats who spent much of their time lashed to the gills!}.

[Avatar]

Uh, I dunno. I've only read the mighty general stuff.

Nothing contemporary.

--A

[peter]

Just brushing up on my 'Classics' Av [Why in the UK do we study 'Classics' where in America they study 'The Classics' ?]

[Avatar]

Seems a bit broad either way. We study "Classical Something." Literature or whatever.

--A

[peter]

Just read in the same book how, during the course of a diplomatic mission to prevent a 'war' between the Greek city of Tarantus and a Roman army in the 3rd C. BC. the Roman envoy, in an attempt to impress the Greek 'diplomats' wore their best 'wrap around togas'. Far from being impressed the [less than diplomatic] Greeks began laughing and ridiculing the Romans and [by contempory account] in an almost 'Dumb and Dumber' esq over the top action, one of them "bent down and shit on the offending garment". The Roman envoy Postimus was less than impressed. "Laugh while you can," he said "For you will wash that garment clean with your blood."

Now you don't see that every day on the television!

[Damelon]

I read a book on the Carthaginians recently and according to it; Alexander, after he had returned from India, told a Carthaginian delegation basically that they were next. Carthage was the daughter city of Tyre, in Phoenicia, which was besieged for years by Alexander before it fell.

[peter]

Did Alexander make it back from India - I thought he pretty much died soon thereafter and then his sons(?) ripped his empire apart because they could not agree on who should inherit his mantle. This besiegement you refer to Damelon must have been what, four hundred years before the demise of Carthage in the Punic Wars. I hadn't realised Carthage persisted for so long! Must check my facts on these things; at my age trying to retain facts is like trying to hold onto eels in a bucket - difficult!

[Damelon]

He died, I believe, in Babylon. I don't think he meant to go back to Greece. Alexander besieged Tyre around 330 B.C. and died in 323 B.C. The First Punic War began in 264 B.C. Tyre couldn't have been independent for some time, they were under Persian rule, but the Phoenicians did provide the Persians with most of their fleet.

I think he had only one son of his own, who was young and died soon after him. His generals were the ones who divided up what he had. Ptolemy in Egypt, Selucus (sp?) in Syria and the east, and another in Greece.

[peter]

Wow - serious bit of historical dislocation there on my part; still - at least I got the 'Punic' bit right [I toyed with Pelloponesian for a moment or two ]

[Damelon]

Wow - serious bit of historical dislocation there on my part; still - at least I got the 'Punic' bit right [I toyed with Pelloponesian for a moment or two ]

You weren't that far off. It's not like any of them are likely to complain.

I am familiar with Mary Beard. She used to write a column for an online version of a UK newspsper. I forget which one. But I would regularly look up her column.

Alexander seems to be a benchmark for egocentric overachievers. He accomplished so much at such a young age. I think he was 33 when he died. Julius Caesar, Napoleon, and I think Winston Churchill all at some point in their career looked to his and mourned about how far behind they were.

[Hashi Lebwohl]

Ghengis Khan's empire was 6 times larger than Alexander's.

Being a citizen in Alexander's Empire was probably great if you were already Hellenistic. If you were a conquered Persian, Phrygian, or any one of a number of kingdoms in Asia Minor or India then his Empire might not have been so great.

On the other hand, your life under those regimes probably wasn't that great, anyway, from certain points of view--taxation, famine, plague, etc. You know--the usual stuff.

[Damelon]

The Mongols were better organized than the Greeks. It wasn't all Ghengis though. Subatai, who served Ghengis and his sons, was one of the best military leaders in history; making use of intelligence to tailor tactics to the opponent.