God Help Us

[spacemonkey]

Well, being the usual strong willed silent type I don't usually express these things,not publicly at any rate.The recent loss of so many children at the hands of sick pedo-philes is more than I can take.I know there isn't much I can do,but pray for the children.My heart lies breaking within,my soul at a loss,parts of me fell empty of the loss of children I will never meet.Please.Can somebody tell me when this will stop? WHY does it have to be the kids?They've only just begun life........I'm going to stop here,my heart can't say much more.any spiritual guidance here would be helpful.............

[balon!]

Its those kinds of things that make we wonder, If there is a God why is stuff like that hapenning?

I take the stand, that God is sitting back and watching what we do with our world. That scares me more. What kind of message is our species sending an Almighty?

[Avatar]

Sorry man, I certainly can't offer any spiritual guidance. Not of the religious kind anyway.

Sometimes, perfectly ordinary people go out and do terrible inhuman things to other perfectly ordinary people.

I suppose I'm buffered in some way by the fact that I don't believe that there is any over-riding reason or purpose for anything.

And while I know that it's not the answer you were looking for at all, I'm afraid that it will never stop. Not unless we wipe everybody on earth out anyway.

It's a lose-lose situation I'm afraid. You can't stop these aberrations until they do something, and once they've done something, you have more victims.

(Not very comforting, am I? Sorry.)

But it doesn't have to be the kids. It happens to adults all the time too. It's just that when it happens to children it eats at us all the more.

--A

[spacemonkey]

These ideas of yours and Balon's surely show a few things,more than you realize and yes they were helpful.I just have to remeber that you can't have a back without a front,up without a down...........It's still very disheartening and horribly sad,I guess what bugged me most is the kids.........

[Cail]

It's going to keep happening until we get serious about child sex offenders. Mandatory life sentences or the death penalty is the only way to keep them from harming our children.

[Avatar]

I disagree Cail. Not on the fact that we need to be harsher on them, I totally agree with that. But all that will do is prevent repeat offences.

It won't do anything about the first time offences, because they have to have done something before we can try, convict and execute them. Which means that there will still be a victim (at least one victim) for every one you catch.

And spacemonkey is right...it is impossible to have anything without having its opposite as well. Utterly impossible.

No justice without injustice, no freedom without oppression, no joy without pain. Things are defined in terms of opposites.

--A

[Cail]

This is true, but look at the track record....The last year or so has seen a lot of high-profile child cases, and many of the sickos have been repeat offenders.

It's not a solution, but it is a start.

[Avatar]

That I'll certainly agree with. It's a start.

The only solution though may turn out to be impossible...and that is finding some way to prevent people becoming paedophiles in the first place.

And I don't see that happening any time soon. Not until we know what causes it in the first place, if ever. But I'll settle for your start in the meantime.

--A

[dlbpharmd]

It's clear to me that no punishment is enough to deter maniacs and perverts from their obsessions.

[duchess of malfi]

I think this stuff has always gone on, but as a society we have become more open about discussing it - and that is one of the best things that can happen.

Too often this stuff seems to happen in chains of transmission. While we will never know, it is widely felt in my family that my grandfather molested at least a couple of his children. He was mentally ill and violent at any rate, his last known partner was a teenager when he was in his frickin 80's; and at least two of his children grew up to be child molestors. (my mother and one of my uncles). In the case of my uncle, he tried to molest one of my cousins when she was in her teens. She immediately called her mother, and my aunt had a hissy and he never tried anything with my cousin again.

But what was he doing with his own daughter???

That question will haunt me forever, and no one in my family is in touch with her, or even knows where to find her.

In the generation of my grandparents and parents, this stuff was all swept under the rug, and hidden away like it was some sort of shameful thing.

Well, it is a shameful thing - but not talking about it and hiding it means that the child it was done to will never get any sort of help or justice.

And when someone holds in that much pain and shame and blame (many of the victims think it is something that they have done) for a lifetime, I think it is possible for them to snap.

Not that that is any kind of an excuse - if you know how wrong it is first hand why would you ever do something like it to someone else??? But nevertheless, that seems to be what happens sometimes.

The fact that this stuff is more out in the open now is very healthy. Most parents these days would get immediate help for their children, so that the kids know that they are blameless and will not have to grow up with this huge load of crap inside of themselves (or at least - not as much crap). The justice system is very willing in most cases to step in and take measures to get offenders off the streets.

Hopefully in time it will become even more open, so serial offenders like those infamous priests will never be able to prey upon children again. So that any child that is touched in an inappropriate way will come to parents or teachers or other people immediately, no matter what the molester tells them about it being their fault and to stay quiet about it.

But as Av said, this will not stop the first time offenders.

And when it happens inside a family, that will always be a mess made of love, hatred, guilt, horror, and every other strong emotion you can think of, all mixed up and churning inside of the victim.

All I can say is:


If this has happened to you, it is not your fault. it was not your fault. It is not your fault. It was not your fault. You did not do anything to deserve it. It does not mean that you will ever do this to a child yourself.

It does not matter how long ago it happened - it is never too late to get help.

Sometimes this does not come back to you until you have your own children, and they are the age you were when you were hurt. This is normal. It just means that you were emotionally unready to deal with the pain of it. See how precious and blameless your children are - you were equally precious and blameless when someone hurt you.

It is never too late to get help to deal with the pain of what happened.

It was not your fault. It was not your fault!!!

[SoulQuest1970]

Its those kinds of things that make we wonder, If there is a God why is stuff like that hapenning?

I take the stand, that God is sitting back and watching what we do with our world. That scares me more. What kind of message is our species sending an Almighty?

Two words...

Free will.

Remember what Donaldson says about creators? They are helpless, but can work through others.

[balon!]

Its those kinds of things that make we wonder, If there is a God why is stuff like that hapenning?

I take the stand, that God is sitting back and watching what we do with our world. That scares me more. What kind of message is our species sending an Almighty?

Two words...

Free will.

Remember what Donaldson says about creators? They are helpless, but can work through others.

Seems more like Foul than the Creator to me.


On another note, If there are going to be some many people with life sentences, why not put them to use? One word: Treadwells.

I LOVE free energy!

[spacemonkey]

I think this stuff has always gone on, but as a society we have become more open about discussing it - and that is one of the best things that can happen.

Too often this stuff seems to happen in chains of transmission. While we will never know, it is widely felt in my family that my grandfather molested at least a couple of his children. He was mentally ill and violent at any rate, his last known partner was a teenager when he was in his frickin 80's; and at least two of his children grew up to be child molestors. (my mother and one of my uncles). In the case of my uncle, he tried to molest one of my cousins when she was in her teens. She immediately called her mother, and my aunt had a hissy and he never tried anything with my cousin again.

But what was he doing with his own daughter???

That question will haunt me forever, and no one in my family is in touch with her, or even knows where to find her.

In the generation of my grandparents and parents, this stuff was all swept under the rug, and hidden away like it was some sort of shameful thing.

Well, it is a shameful thing - but not talking about it and hiding it means that the child it was done to will never get any sort of help or justice.

And when someone holds in that much pain and shame and blame (many of the victims think it is something that they have done) for a lifetime, I think it is possible for them to snap.

Not that that is any kind of an excuse - if you know how wrong it is first hand why would you ever do something like it to someone else??? But nevertheless, that seems to be what happens sometimes.

The fact that this stuff is more out in the open now is very healthy. Most parents these days would get immediate help for their children, so that the kids know that they are blameless and will not have to grow up with this huge load of crap inside of themselves (or at least - not as much crap). The justice system is very willing in most cases to step in and take measures to get offenders off the streets.

Hopefully in time it will become even more open, so serial offenders like those infamous priests will never be able to prey upon children again. So that any child that is touched in an inappropriate way will come to parents or teachers or other people immediately, no matter what the molester tells them about it being their fault and to stay quiet about it.

But as Av said, this will not stop the first time offenders.

And when it happens inside a family, that will always be a mess made of love, hatred, guilt, horror, and every other strong emotion you can think of, all mixed up and churning inside of the victim.

All I can say is:


If this has happened to you, it is not your fault. it was not your fault. It is not your fault. It was not your fault. You did not do anything to deserve it. It does not mean that you will ever do this to a child yourself.

It does not matter how long ago it happened - it is never too late to get help.

Sometimes this does not come back to you until you have your own children, and they are the age you were when you were hurt. This is normal. It just means that you were emotionally unready to deal with the pain of it. See how precious and blameless your children are - you were equally precious and blameless when someone hurt you.

It is never too late to get help to deal with the pain of what happened.

It was not your fault. It was not your fault!!!

By far the finest post I have seen yet on this site,hands down.This is why I get so enraged and passionate about children,I was molested at a young age and the abuse stopped here.No,it doesn't have to continue,yes,I am blameless,I did nothing wrong.These actions in my past still haunt me to this day.No,I don't want/need help,it's one of the things that helped to shape who I am today,I give no quarter to rapists,pedophiles or anyone else who takes what is supposed to be a gift to someone else by force.I HATE it,these people are beyond sick and if they went so far as the Amish killer then everybody around that person didn't know/recognize the danger signs. But to the reason for this topic,I personally was overwhelmed for a small group of children that I will never meet. It really angers me,wishing that someone would have stopped it sooner.But I reminded myself that no matter how bad something seems that there is always SOME good to be found,in any situation. Still it's the very idea of innocence lost so soon,lives ended for a sicko's perverse pleasure strikes at the very soul of what is supposed to be everyone's future. For a moment,I lost heart, I lost resolve, I sought others who might have shed light on something that really bothered me. Thanks for saying something, anything,even if it didn't really seem to pertain to the subject it showed that ALL of you still belonged to the human race,and truth be known,restored some measure of my own faith in man............................................

[duchess of malfi]

I feel absolutely enraged when things like the Amish shooting happen. I feel enraged and helpless whenever I hear of a child being abused or molested.

Like you, I was mistreated while a child. And it will always affect me, haunt me.

But - while there can be evil and horror in the world - there can also be love and laughter and beauty beyond measure. And we must always remember that, especially in the face of evil.

In this life we have a choice - free will if you wish to call it that. We can add to the horror or we can add to the beauty.

[spacemonkey]

I have taken the root of the horror and turned it into beauty,everyone here doesn't really know that much about me,I have what has been called in the past an iron will.That which should have scarred me has instead bolstered my psyche.I will not be used by anyone for any reason, I am no one's slave.It happened once,never again. This may sound horrible,but there was a German Nazi who said:"That which does not kill you makes you stronger." I don't know who said it.It is something that I have taken quite literally,and it does indeed work. So there's one of the reasons why I get so passionate about crimes against children..................

[Avatar]

It wasn't a Nazi, but it was Nietzsche. And no, it doesn't sound horrible...I believe it myself.

Excellent posts folks. *bows*

--A

[Prebe]

"That which does not kill you makes you stronger."

Like a sublethal coronary thrombosis?

[Avatar]

I'm pretty sure he meant it in a more psychological way.

Although...if you learn a lesson from it to live healthier/whatever, then maybe it has made you stronger in a sense...

--A

[SoulQuest1970]

My past abuse does not haunt me. If it did, then my abuser wins. No... it has made me stronger and compassionate. Also more aware of the world and my kids. I can take that pain from the past and let it hurt me or I can take that pain and think what I can do in this world to prevent others from feeling this pain or help them heal if they have felt that pain. I chose several years ago to do the latter. It's working great for me!

[spacemonkey]

It wasn't a Nazi, but it was Nietzsche. And no, it doesn't sound horrible...I believe it myself.

Excellent posts folks. *bows*

--A

AH,yes, Thanx for the correction Av,for some reason I thought it might have been a Nazi..........